| LED Digest 2246: PPC Fraud & Traffic Quality |
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A discussion today about PPC engines and the problems associated with them, such as click fraud and low-quality site referrals. One member talks about the increase in quality visitors he experienced by ending his PPC. ================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom pair Networks: The LED's Web Host Hosting and Domain Registration from a Trusted Leader pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. September 14, 2006 Issue no. 2246 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ====== NEW ====================== --== PPC Engine Fraud & Traffic Quality ==-- ~ Robert Bass "Finally I decided to wing it...drop the PPC advertising altogether." ==== CONTINUING ================= --== The Evolution of Email ==-- ~ Dr. Mani Sivasubramanian "I've implemented a system which I will soon be replicating on other niches..." ~ John Smart "There was talk of RSS replacing email..." --== The Search Guru ==-- ~ Michael Martinez "...there are too many voices, many of them ill- informed and convinced of their own righteousness." ==== BILLBOARD =================== --== Getting Traffic ==-- ~ R. Deisler ========== NEW =================================== From: Robert Bass Subject: PPC Engines - Click Fraud & Traffic Quality Adam, I do not know if this would be considered a new topic or more of an old one but I want to share this information with your readers. I think it is important that they know this. I had advertised with Overture and Google PPC since its inception, about 4 or 5 years ago. Early on the ROI was very high but as more and more people discovered the internet as a venue for selling merchandise it began to dwindle. Bidding wars for top positions ensued. Costs began to rise. Still, I stayed with it. But my costs increased dramatically and my visitors and sales dropped dramatically about a year ago, almost simultaneously all the talk about click fraud was dominating magazines like this one. I wrote dozens of letters to both Google and Yahoo (Overture) questioning my bills... how could my bills be so high when my visitor stick rate had fallen so dramatically? In the "old days" the average visitor stayed on my site to view at least eight pages, but as the costs grew the average visitor stayed only long enough to view one page, the title page. Smells of click fraud, doesn't it? More visitors, less stickiness, and higher costs. Hey if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck....... Both Google and Yahoo denied click fraud existed (yet I also got a letter from Google about a class action lawsuit settlement pertinent to that very topic), both offered me ways to "improve" my ads, hit a larger target audience... blah blah blah. But the costs kept mounting. Finally about two months ago I decided to wing it... drop the PPC advertising altogether. And you know what? Nothing terrible happened. I run about 30 keywords and when I test them from time to time I find that my site shows up in position 1, 2, or 3 in the free listings on most of the major search engines. For some reason, it varies. The free listings, I pay nothing for them. In fact I think my activity has improved somewhat, my sales are up and my orders average bigger than they did when I paid for it. I can tell you this: my profit is way up as I do not have to pay all those PPC bills. For the amount I was spending on PPC advertising, I had to do in excess of five figures every month just to cover the PPC costs. And not every month covered it, I was actually running in the red for awhile. Now, I don't. My activity is still coming in from all over the USA and many foreign countries. I also seem to be getting a higher grade of computer literate customer, when I answer their techno questions they know what I am talking about. The ones that came in from the PPC ads considered themselves as contributors on the internet because they could send an email to their mother. But could not understand cache overload or what a cookie was for. The only major change seems to be my costs, and concerns over ROI, and the sick feeling knowing that I was being cheated, wondering how many others were suffering the same way and feeling so powerless to stop it. Now, I sleep nights, very content. Despite what these PPC engines would have you believe, I still maintain that the Emperor has no clothes. Robert Bass, webmaster www.jewelex.com ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Dr. Mani Sivasubramanian Subject: Email publishing > How is RSS helping you connect with a larger > readership, and how is it being combined with > other aspects of content management, such > as blogs and forums? - Moderator Comment, LED 2245 I'm not the first (or only) person to do this, so I'll jump in before the others and answer this :) On my blog, 'Dr.Mani says...', I've implemented a system which I will soon be replicating on other niches: http://www.ezinemarketingcenter.com/drmani-says/ I publish a post on the blog. The blog is tied in to my Aweber autoresponder, and depending upon the settings, will send out a mailing to my list every 2 or 3 posts. The 'Comments' link at the bottom of each post is tied in to my niche forum on which there is a separate section to discuss what's on the blog. The forum itself has a hack which creates an RSS feed for discussions, and I feed it to other sections of my website. I also have seen a script that presents the same threaded discussion in the form of an online forum or a blog, so blog comments show up as 'replies' on the forum, and vice versa. If I wanted to, I could set up my blog to publish by email, so by sending out an email message, it would be published on my blog, go out to my list, spark off a discussion on the forum, and seed my website with fresh content - automatically :) Dr.Mani -------- new post - same topic -------- From: John Smart Subject: Email publishing We worked with a client a while back who was giving away a bed and a car (it made sense at the time) -- they had an opt in mail list of about 4,000 addresses. Many of them were AOL (my nemesis). As we worked through different options, it became apparent (to me, not to my client) that a mailing list with only 4,000 addresses was not worth the work in sending to. I wrote a script that sent out the mails from the database, personalizing each one (we had names tallied to each address). I spent a lot of time working on the mail -- knowing what was classed as spam, and as cheating, we tried really hard to come up with good, honest subject lines that wouldn't get blocked 'Win a free car' was obviously out, and I refused to do anything like 'UU1n @ Fr33 c@r' on the grounds of decency). We had the same problem with content. When your message is about winning a free something, and you have no other real news, getting that message past spam filters (even when the people signed up to be notified of such an event) is not easy to do. I had meant to monitor the results of the mailing, and was distracted by pressures of work. All the mails were sent with a genuine return and from address. I understand from the promoter about 1,200 were returned -- which I think is amazing, I was expecting about 3,000 to be bounced back. The bottom of each e-Mail had my address on it as the address to send complaints / opt-out notices. I didn't receive 1 complaint. That showed me that if people opt in, and you send them something fun -- they are happy. I see that in my own reaction to bulk e-Mail. Albertson's gave me two free movie rentals in return for my e-Mail address. I figure that they are going to send me offers by e-Mail, and so long as I don't get 1 a day, I will look at them -- hey, I may even save some money! I love the Trader Joe's flyer (To English People: Trader Joe's sells great, healthy (usually) organic food -- unusual food, all at a great price) and would happily sign up for an e-Mail version -- that would be easier for me than going to the store to get one. There was talk of RSS replacing e-Mail. At the time I thought 'how silly' -- but I now have a Google home page that gives my RSS feeds from around the world. The idea of having an RSS feed from Trader Joe's appeals to me. I can see having an RSS feed from some of our suppliers also, so I can see the 'deal of the day' -- however there is still the basic problem. Suppose I give an RSS Feed that gives HTML tips, and details of advantages to hosting with me (not the world's most popular rss info, but let's be honest, hosting isn't exciting!) How would I let Adam, for instance, know about it? He may visit my site, and learn about it there. He may read the tag line on my post and follow that link. But the 2 base problems with spam and e-Mail still exist: The only way I can be sure to tell a lot of people is to send out UCE (Sure, doing well in google helps, but see point 2 before you flame me!). UCE only exists because it works. If you are doing this, you get an off shore hosting account, pay a lot of money for a CD full of addresses, pay for the software to send all the mails, and still make a profit! If no one responded to spam for three months, there would be no spam. The fact is, spam works -- it works on me, and I get the idea that if it didn't work, it wouldn't exist. Sometimes one creeps under my spam filter, and it catches my eye! I click the link. (shame on me) The real solution is one that we are very unlikely to see. When the internet was growing UCE was not a concern. The mail protocols need to be written with more security, so you have to prove you are sending from where you are sending. This would mean a need to update all web based e-Mail programs, and all Outlook / communicator programs. Alas, I don't think it will ever happen -- but it would work. In Bill Gates 'The Road Ahead' book, he wrote about what I think is a great idea. Suppose I want to send you a mail, but you don't know me -- let's assume it is a spam for my wonderful hosting. My research shows me that you are hosting with an inferior competitor -- and I know you would do better to host with me, therefore you are a likely conversion. I could embed into my e-Mail an amount of money (a PayPal transaction perhaps) so that if you open my e-Mail, you will receive $5.00. This will hopefully stop you being angry about my e-Mail, and will cause you to view it at least with an open mind. This idea is widely used by telephone companies -- I often get a check for $10, with small print on the back saying that by cashing the check I agree to move over to use their long distance service. I consider the options, and throw the check away! But if they just gave me the $10, I would consider it more carefully! But this is technology that does not exist at this time -- maybe it will. The fact that Gates suggested it implies that Microsoft is working on it -- if Microsoft makes it happen, most others will follow. Would I pay you $10 to read a mail from me? I don't know -- I would probably experiment with it. I would certainly pay Adam $10 to let me tell all of you I will pay any one of you $10 if you move over to host with me! John Smart InternetDesign.com - A Human Touch in a Digital World -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Michael Martinez Subject: Search guru > Why are people apparently up in arms when > recognized and established names in a very > well established industry speak regularly at > conferences or post knowledgeable advice > and commentary? - Mike Banks Valentine, LED 2243 > SEO is hardly a "very well established industry". > As others here have stated, there are no standards > whatsoever. Anyone can claim to be an SEO expert, > and then begin a program of effective self promotion... - Dirk Johnson, LED 2245 I've spent part of the last two weeks looking for a new job, and I've looked at a fair number of so-called "SEO" positions on various job boards. They require many skills that have nothing to do with SEO. And the positions usually call for less than 5 years' experience with search optimization (I feel heavily specialized and over-qualified for these jobs). These are not really SEO jobs. They are IT jobs with SEO duties, or advertising jobs with PPC duties. There are no standards, the industry is very young, and today's gurus will become tomorrow's old hats. I don't see the need to rationalize or defend search engine optimization. People have been questioning its value for years, and they'll continue to question its value. But I think there are too many voices, many of them both ill-informed and convinced of their own righteousness. > SEO, I feel, would be a difficult field to teach in > universities: courses would require copywriting > / journalism, marketing, library sciences and > computer sciences. A very heavy course load... > I don't think SEOs will disappear in the near > future, but once businesses become more > savvy, they will demand more, and that likely > includes credentials. - Barb Sybal, LED 2243 The lack of credentials is notable, but I disagree with you about how difficult it would be to teach SEO in universities. Information management degrees have been made available for decades in library sciences and related fields. Search engine optimization is not about marketing, journalism, or wiring computers. It's about taking content and organizing it to be found in search engines. I think it would be very helpful for most people if there were credentialed faces coming into the industry. Today's search engine optimization gurus lack the discipline, and really the training and experience, that is required to do proper analysis. They tend to throw links at Web sites as if they were tossing darts in the general direction of a board without actually looking. I can get most any new domain to rank well in about 2 months these days. I'm still hearing SEOs complain about needing a year or longer. I've been writing SEO theory for several years now. Nearly every idea I've presented has been ridiculed, challenged, questioned, reviewed, considered, praised, and -- if it was genuinely useful -- eventually repeated and passed on. Much of today's conventional SEO wisdom was published by a few people years ago, laughed at, and ignored for a long time. The real problem with SEO isn't that there are so many idiots out there espousing the insane schemes of the misguided. It's because the momentum of group-think is unimaginably huge. It takes a really, really long time to get people to stop muttering their holy mantras and realize that something significant has changed. Yahoo! published its first TrustRank paper in early 2004. By late summer 2006, most SEOs are only starting to acknowledge that TrustRank is not a Google thing and that trust is now an increasingly important factor. It now seems apparent that Google was playing the trust card in 2004 (and Ask was using trust long before Google), but it has taken 2 years for the SEO community to wake up and smell the dead links. BTW: If anyone has a real SEO job available, I might be interested. I don't have the credentials, but I'll put my SEO skills up against anyone else's. I've been doing this for longer than 5 years, if that matters. Michael Martinez http://seo.xenite.org/ ==== BILLBOARD =================================== From: R. Deisler Subject: Getting Traffic This is going to sound pretty amateurish, I'm sure, but how do I start getting traffic?! Here's the deal with my situation here: I've started a Web site about 3 months ago, and have been updating content every day. It is quality and original material mostly written by myself and a few others. Here's what I'm thinking for marketing / promoting the site once the content is up: - Directory Submissions: Yahoo ($$), ODP (good luck?), other for-pay and free directories; - AdWords campaign, perhaps a few other networks; - Linking campaign (I hope to get some links naturally once the site is found, the content will be in demand. But should I wait? Or should I buy some of those high-value and high-cost links on the big dog sites?) - Social bookmarking: hitting up the major tagging / bookmarking sites with user accounts and commenting on my content; - Email newsletter (need to build this up and ping site visitors about content); - Press releases: I plan on rolling out a PR campaign once I have something newsworthy to spin; - other ideas? As you can see, I've got a partial idea about what to do, but I'm at a loss here! How do I get momentum happening. Right now I'm getting barely 50 uniques per day (according to Google Analytics) with 150 page views. Pretty meager traffic, and the AdSense results show it: just 2 or 3 clicks on a good day. Help a newbie here please. Just trying to absorb all this great info. Am I on the right track? Any help appreciated. Thanks. R. Deisler ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by pair Networks: pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains Copyright 1995-2006 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "Youth fades; love droops, the leaves of friendship fall; A mother's secret hope outlives them all." - Oliver Wendell Holmes |
