| LED Digest 1803: PPC for Non-Ecommerce Sites |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" pair Networks: The LED's Web Host Hosting and Domain Reg. from a Trusted Leader pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam,led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com ................................................ May 16, 2004 Issue #1803 ................................................ .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ==== CONTINUING ================= --== PPC for Non-Ecommerce Sites ==-- ~ Bob Wakfer "...it should still be possible to calculate an ROI..." ~ Peter Warnock "PPC advertising is appropriate for categories that are being actively searched." --== The Demise of Email? ==-- ~ Adam Boettiger "The groups that are [operating spam-reporting services] are flying below the radar..." ~ James Miller "One thing I do is to send printed copies of spam to the local embassy!" ~ John Smart "The simple solution to spam is one so complex it will never happen." ~ Mark Whitman "...if you're not part of the solution you're part of the problem." ==== BILLBOARD =================== --== 'American' Style of Marketing? ==-- ~ Daniel Lance Herrick ~ Kathryn Martyn --== IE Errors & Customer Confusion ==-- ~ Paul Ding ===== CONTINUING ================================= From: Bob Wakfer Subject: PPC for B2B > Does anyone have any thoughts or research > on PPC for B2B non-ecommerce web sites? - Beth Earle, LED 1802 That is an interesting question. I have no experience with this but I do have a few thoughts. It seems to me that one of the advantage of advertising on the Internet versus conventional media advertising is that you can normally track or calculate your ROI on Internet advertising. Of course on an e-commerce site this is done by directly calculating the profit that is generated by an advertising expenditure. For example, you get a 1,000 click throughs from your AdWord campaign at a cost of $X and these converted to sales and profit of $nX. Now if you are going to use Internet advertising for a non e-commerce site then you need to decide whether your objectives are long term branding, in which case it may be very difficult to determine a specific ROI on the Internet advertising. However, this same difficulty doesn't seem to impinge upon companies' brand advertising expenditures in print, radio and television media, so why should it be an issue with Internet advertising? If the objective of Internet advertising is to drive short term sales it should still be possible to calculate an ROI on the Internet advertising, albeit not with the same degree of accuracy as with an e-commerce site. You should be able to calculate some type of correlation between the additional traffic garnered from the Internet advertising and the total sales of the company products. Regards, Bob Wakfer Computer Partners http://www.compar.com ------- new post - same topic ------- From: Peter Warnock Subject: PPC for B2B PPC advertising is appropriate for categories that are being actively searched. You can get an idea of how many searches are being performed by using the tools available at Overture. Since B2B tickets are often larger, trust is increased with word of mouth and continues to be the strongest opportunity driver. Peter Warnock webstruction.com ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Adam Boettiger Subject: The demise of email > Maybe someone should start a spam-reporting service, > where all of us can forward the spam, and the service > could do the grunt work of reporting to parent companies. ;-) - Tom Anson, LED 1801 > I am a web entrepreneur and a patent attorney with some > litigation experience and have looked into this... The biggest > problem I see is seeding it... - Bob Huntsman, LED 1802 Actually Bob, this has been done and is being done by more than one firm. The biggest problem is not in seeding it. The biggest problem is that the business model is flawed. It's dependent on actually being able to *collect* on judgements. It's one thing to win a judgement but it could be years before any money is seen from it - if at all. It's a great idea in theory, but in execution it is not a very viable one. The groups that are doing this are flying below the radar for obvious reasons. If you want to get more involved in it contact me off-list. Adam Boettiger, Chief Idea Architect I-Advertising http://www.i-advertising.com ab, i-advertising.com ------- new post - same topic ------- From: James Miller Subject: Email demise One thing I do is to send printed copies of spam to the local embassy! They originally gave me a polite response. They don't bother now. If say 200,000 people did this once a week, the governments would take action! James Miller Daisy Analysis www.daisy.co.uk ------- new post - same topic ------- From: John Smart Subject: Email demise I used an anti-spam program for a while that worked on the simple idea that "It is spam if people say it is spam". The more complaints a mail got, the less likely we were to see it if we used this company's product. A wonderful, simple idea. With one problem. People (and I include myself at the top of this list) are stupid. With the best intentions, the best motivations, people can do the dumbest, laziest, most illogical things time and time again. Where am I going with that? One problem I had with this group was I could not get the LED-Digest! I didn't really notice at 1st - I figured there was a delay on the editions going out. Then it dawned on me, and I realized that LED, and a few other journals that I subscribe to were not reaching me. Why was that? People sign up for mailing lists, and forget. Then they either cannot be bothered to unsubscribe, or they fear that it is a spam and unsubscribing will confirm they are at that address and open the door for many more spams to come in. So they report a perfectly good and reputable mailing list as a spam list. The simple solution to spam is one so complex it will never happen. The simple solution is to ignore it. If no one ever responded, the market would die. Everyone complains about spam, yet once in a while, enough will see something that catches their eye and leads to a purchase to make the whole thing worthwhile. John Smart InternetDesign.com - "A Human Touch in a Digital World" ------- new post - same topic ------- From: Mark Whitman Subject: Email demise > But I do attempt to identify and report on 2 or 3 a day - > once you get a routine down for this it only takes a few > minutes (not more than 10). - Tom Aman, LED 1802 Thanks Tom, it's great to know there are still responsible "netizens" out there who realize that if you want to continue to use email, it's your *duty* to be proactive against the "demise of email", which is exactly where *all* UCE ultimately leads. Reporting spam via email however, in many cases, isn't very effective. What's more effective are phone calls. Here's an example: about 3 or 4 years ago I had a customer who wanted to jump start traffic to a new website by spamming. I took a hard line against participating but had no control over what the customer did. He found one of the multitude of spam blasting services masquerading as "legitimate opt-in" email providers and sent out millions of "legitimate" UCE spam messages. His company was immediately bombarded with complaints. It became such a public relations disaster for the company he was fired within days. No more spam from *that* company. I was surprised there were still so many people willing to pick up the phone to complain, a very common practice until the late 90's. Where spam's concerned, if you're not part of the solution you're part of the problem. Mark Whitman ==== BILLBOARD ==================================== From: Daniel Lance Herrick Subject: American marketing > The client is concerned that search engines do not index > more than one or two level deep in a website. Is this true? > How can I convince her otherwise? - Muhammad Shabeer Ali, LED 1802 This is easy. On any page of the site, cut two or three lines and paste them into the box on the Google site. This search will turn up the page in the first few responses. Every page can be number one for some search. Daniel Lance Herrick ------- new post - same topic ------- From: Kathryn Martyn Subject: American marketing First, Shabeer, your client doesn't seem to understand that you are the expert, which I'd assume is why she isn't doing this herself? She sells real estate, right? If you were going to sell your house, you'd call her, not try to do it yourself, so why is she now trying to tell you how to do your job? It may be late at this point to change the dynamic with this client, but at least in the future, present yourself as the expert you are and you'll be more respected. > The client is concerned that search engines do not index > more than one or two level deep in a website. Is this true? Search engines will link to pages they find with relevant content, it makes no different where it is located. Perhaps the client is confused because many search engines in the past, especially when you could submit for free, would require you only list the main page. That is because they would send the bots out to crawl the site. There is no limit to how deep, AFAIK. Plus, not every single page is going to get good placement anyway. You're far better off to put your attention on working on a few pages at a time, than worrying about every page on the site. What seems to work best is to have lots of good content, and plenty of links out to other good content, with links back in from those who share the view that you provide good content. > ... people are less wary of contacting people who do > not indulge in 'LOUD' marketing, like having a website > focusing only on them). The client does not seem so > keen on this. That seems like an excellent idea to me. If your site is about providing value to the visitor, then people will grow to trust you and want to do their business with you. If you trumpet your own horn too loudly, people wonder why you must shout, and whether you are good or are merely puffing yourself up? At least that's my view. I prefer your approach. Kathryn Martyn, M.NLP Ending Emotional Eating, One Bite at a Time http://www.onemorebite-weightloss.com ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Paul Ding Subject: IE errors > The MS bulletin can be found here: > microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS04-004.mspx > Since the patch has to be installed on the user site, there is > really nothing we can do to help the situation, or is there? - Brigitte Burchett, LED 1799 That URL says the bug only affects servers which have a certain configuration. Then it tells you to disable HTTP "keep alive connections" on the server. Paul Ding http://amishhosting.com ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by pair Networks: pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains Copyright 1995-2004 Adam Audette. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "Military intelligence is a contradiction in terms." - Groucho Marx [thanks to James Miller for the quote] |
