| LED Digest 1534: Working with Web Design Firms |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest ................................................. March 10, 2003 Issue #1534 ................................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ==== CONTINUING ================= --== In-House Web Design ==-- ~ Doug Stewart "Here are my 7 cost-cutting-tips on how to work with a web design company..." ~ Beth Earle "I realize I might be sticking my neck out providing all this info..." --== Outsourcing and Globalization ==-- ~ Marty R. Milette "...the global market is speedy and merciless in levelling prices." ==== BILLBOARD =================== --== Regional Search Engines? ==-- ~ Donald Nelson --== Sender Warranted Email & Habeas ==-- ~ Anne Mitchell ===== CONTINUING ================================= From: Doug Stewart Subject: In-house design In the last couple of LED issues questions were raised about whether a website development firm can do as good a job as an in-house web design team can. In my opinion, an in-house team has a lot of advantages, but most LED readers can't afford an in-house web design time. So that means the owner of the company has to be the webmaster, designer, salesperson, CEO and whatever-other-job they have to be today. Or they need to know how to work with a web design team. Here are my 7 cost-cutting-tips on how to work with a web design company AND get a great looking website: 1) Do your homework first. Find great looking, powerful websites that you like first and bookmark them. Choose at least three. These do not need to be in your industry. Choose these websites for the graphic look only. If you see a site that looks great, but you're concerned that "I could never afford something like this," put it on your list anyway. I good web designer can find ways to accomplish similar visual effects without charging you an arm and a leg. 2) What is the main impression you want people to get from your website? Many websites suffer from conflicting messages and goals. If you try to get your website to do too many things for too many people, your graphic designer will have a hard time making your website look right. The clearer and more focused your website's objective, the easier it will be for a designer to put together a good design. It will also help you with search engine placement. The tighter the focus of your website, the better off you will be. 3) Whenever possible get digital images from your suppliers and your print shop (for logos or past brochures). If a website design firm has to "re-create" your logo or if a website design firm has to scan images, your costs will increase. The more prepared you are in this area, the lower your costs will be. 4) If you don't already have a logo, don't pay your website designer to create one for you. Go to someone who specializes in making logos. You can get a good logo inexpensively at places like, http://www.logolabs.com. There are also designers that are very good at this and can do it fairly reasonably. Your logo can really make or break the look of your website. 5) Changes made in the middle of working on a website can be costly. Plan your site ahead of time. Know what you want on the website. Know how many pages you want (or have a pretty good idea). Plan what pages you believe you need to be successful. Write your text out ahead of time for some of your key pages. Get examples ready from other websites of things that you want done. 6) TOP SECRET TIP: You can really save a lot of money by having your website designer create your home page and a template for the rest of the pages on your site. Then use FrontPage, Adobe Go Live or some other product to put the text in yourself. This will save you a bunch of bucks. Plus you will get a very sharp, professional website for cheap. 7) Skip the FLASH animation. Most Flash designers charge big bucks for their work (and most Flash designers are worth every penny they charge). But Flash animation doesn't usually equal extra cash from your website. It usually just means it will cost more to maintain and it will cost more upfront. I'm sure there are applications where Flash can increase sales, but not as a general rule. So save the cash, don't use Flash. In summary, the key is to plan your website and do your homework first. Then talk to website designers. You'll be able to get a good deal AND get a great looking website. Doug Stewart dsc-webservices.com ------- new post - same topic ------- From: Beth Ann Earle Subject: In-house design The LED Digest has been a great resouce, and I've been quite impressed with the expertise (and helpfulness!) of the Digest members, but in reading through all of the posts about "expensive" vs. "inexpensive" web work, I was shocked to find out that someone considered $50 per hour for a programmer to be too expensive. And based on Mr. Jimenez's comment ("... those were generally VERY expensive in comparison."), I've got to ask ... what is considered expensive? As a general rule of thumb, we would charge around $8,000 for a 10-page, SE-optimized, non-ecommerce, b2b web site that includes a contact form that dumps its information into a database for the client's use. I realize I might be sticking my neck out providing all this info, but http://www.asbindustries.com is one of the most basic examples of our work that would fall in this general price range. The overall response from our clients is good -- they're getting decent traffic, search engine performance and leads, with a few leads every year actually resulting in sales (since these are manufacturers, in many cases simply one sale pays for the site itself). For the level of performance and professionalism they receive, it seems as if our clients get a good value for the money. But even though I know they get a good value, that doesn't make much of a difference if the prospect's perception is that we're overpriced. What do you guys think? Yours in all that is LEDly, Beth Earle ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Marty R. Milette Subject: Outsourcing & Globalization I am thoroughly enjoying this thread, as there are LED members on BOTH sides of the outsourcing equation. To put things in perspective, let me share a little story with you... About 5 years ago I came to Russia and wanted to work with a local ISP to do hosting for Russian web sites and businesses. I was apalled that the Russian ISPs wanted over $100 US per month, for the SAME level of hosting, space, bandwidth and service that I could get in the USA or Canada for just $20 per month. Apples to Apples. I told them this, and they said, the hell with you -- this is the price we charge, this is the price we've always charged, case closed. The result -- I took my hosting requirements to the USA and Canada -- and the Russian company was the loser. (Does this attitude seem vaguely FAMILIAR to you -- a mirror-reflection of the CURRENT situation perhaps??? :) What I was UNABLE to EXPLAIN to them was that when you provide a service -- if a client can get the SAME service elsewhere for a cheaper price -- they really have no choice (if THEY want to stay in business). The same holds true these days about outsourcing. 'Capitalists' should understand this -- it's called "The law of supply and demand." Now, the shoe is on the other foot -- and American workers are still demanding $50 to $100 US per hour to do work that can be done in India, or Russia for $10 or $20 US per hour. Programming (among many skills) is NO LONGER the 'elite' skill that it once was -- and the global market is speedy and merciless in levelling prices. This ain't news to anyone who's been in the business for any length of time -- I have a CD on my desk with a list of over 250 US companies NOW outsourcing their software development JUST to Isreal. The solution is NOT to start waving your arms, (and flags) and moan and bitch about it. The solution is -- if you want more work and more money -- then you'd better move your butt UP the food chain to skills that ARE still 'elite'. Look at developing higher-level skills that CANNOT be done offshore. You are your own career manager! I know a 23 year old Internet Security Expert on contract for a drug company in Germany who's earning over $1,500 US per day. In fact, there are tens of thousands of highly paid contract and full-time positions available all over the world -- IF you have the SKILLS and KNOWLEDGE to fill them. (I also know a 45 year old guy who still lives at home and 'beebles' doing cheap web sites and can't even afford a beer!) I'm not a 'stupid' businessman -- I know darn well that a high school kid who's willing to work for peanuts doesn't know enough about my business (OR the Internet) to prepare a useful (revenue generating!) site. But on the other hand, if I can get someone who builds a site like yandex.ru with a Google Page Rank of 7/10 and an Alexa of 351 (YES, Three HUNDRED and fifty one!) for $20 US per hour -- it's a bargain I can't (and shouldn't) pass up! What many of you have found, as I myself have -- is that unless you have something 'special' to offer -- you ARE going to be competing against high school kids and offshore people. I saw this situation coming -- and spent the past 5 years focusing on advancing my skills and certifications so I CAN charge good money for my work. The question is -- what will YOU do over the coming months to improve YOUR skills and opportunities? Marty R. Milette five-star-hotels.com ==== BILLBOARD ==================================== From: Donald Nelson Subject: Regional Search Engines Dear All, One of my clients would like his products advertised to a European audience. I would be interested to know if LED members have found some regional, country-specific search engines that are particularly effective in generating traffic from the major European countries. Thanks for your input. Donald Nelson A1-Optimization http://www.a1-optimization.com ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Anne P. Mitchell, Esq. Subject: Re: Habeas Dear Mr. Eskelson and LED readers, > But don't take my word for it. Ask many of your newsletter > and e-zine colleagues, such as Wilson Internet, Tidbits, > and Lockergnome... - Anne Mitchell, LED 1532 > I just received my monthly newsletter from Wilson Internet, > and there are *no* Habeas headers... nor does the list owner > request or require double opt-in confirmation, which apparently > is a prerequisite for the use of the Habeas service. > Does the quote above require some clarification? - Dan Eskelson, LED 1533 Apparently. :-) Our requirements for use of our mark in mailing list email include that *that* email be confirmed opt-in. Unlike many other organizations, we do not feel we have the right to tell you how to run your business, or your mailing lists. Hence we do not require that *all* email from a site adhere to our standards, only that email which bears the Habeas mark. Sites are free to continue using their non-confirmed-opt-in lists, so long as they do not use our mark in it - and to use our mark in those lists which are confirmed opt-in (we call this "segmenting lists" - you could even have one list which has both confirmed and non-confirmed addresses, and you are free to use our mark in those which are confirmed, while not in those which are not, for the same list). Because the list you are on with Wilson Web is not confirmed opt-in, it cannot bear our mark. However, I assure you that Wilson Web is a Habeas licensee: http://www.wilsonweb.com/reviews/habeas.htm Best regards, Anne Mitchell http://www.habeas.com ------------------------------------------------------- Copyright 1995-2003 Adam Audette. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country and mankind its citizens." - Baha'u'llah |
