| LED Digest 2367: Understanding Google Rankings |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom www.GetWebContent.com/LED : the LED's Key Sponsor The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. March 14, 2007 Issue no. 2367 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ======= NEW ==================== <Moderator Comment> ~ Wanted: Programmers ~ PR Services ~ Moving Sites --== Figuring out Google Rankings ==-- ~ Tom Anson "Am I missing something really important...?" ==== CONTINUING ================= --== Hosting - 1and1.com? ==-- ~ Joe Halbrook "I've been exceptionally satisfied with my hosting company, ArteryPlanet..." --== The SEO Thread ==-- ~ Michael Martinez "I'm not planning to earn SEMPO certification. I'm not impressed..." ~ Al Toman "My guess is that those who claim to be SEO are not SEO at all." ========== NEW =================================== <Moderator Comment> Greetings LEDer, A slow day today and a great time to take care of some things. (1) WANTED: PROGRAMMERS First off, I need programmers for a large project. Specifically I need talented, experienced, and creative PHP and MySQL developers (Perl is a plus too). Experience with open source forums and blogging packages a big plus. This will be a high visibility project with a large site and an excellent portfolio builder. Please email me if you're interested in chatting about this project. (2) MARKETING with PRESS RELEASES I recently read a fantastic post by Lee Odden about using press releases as marketing tools (for exposure, traffic, and importantly backlinks). Among the excellent advice given is to use landing pages ala PPC campaigns, to deploy standard keyword optimization techniques, and to leverage social media sites. Really good info, here's a link to the full article: http://www.toprankblog.com/2007/03/press-releases-as-marketing-tools/ Here's the question I have (in 2 parts): - Do you use PR campaigns? If so, what success do you have? - What PR services do you like using - PRWeb, Business Wire, PRNewswire, or another? Why? Hit me with some knowledge. (3) CHANGING DOMAINS - WHAT to EXPECT? Alright, so here's the deal. You've got an established website, lots of content, and some solid backlinks. But the domain sucks, and you want to switch to the fancy new one you just bought. What's the correct way to go? Do you gather all the URLs and redirect them individually (time consuming), or do you set up a 301 and send incoming links to the root domain (easy, but kludgy)? There's lots of different opinions on redirecting an old domain to a new one. Some people claim a 301 is all it takes, while others point out all the fancy stuff you have to do. Rand Fishkin's take: ----------------------- "1. Create single 301 re-directs for all pages from the old site pointing to the proper URLs on the new site "2. Change all links on the old site to point to the new site (rather than pointing to the re-directed pages) "3. Review your analytics for the top 2-300 domains sending traffic to the old pages and contact as many as possible about changing their links "4. Review a Yahoo! Site Explorer command for your site and repeat the process in Step 3 with the top 2-300 results returned (Yahoo! tends to show more important links first) "5. Make sure that both the old site and the new site have been verified and have sitemaps submitted at Google's Webmaster Central" Source: http://www.seomoz.org/blog/expectations-and-best-practices... ----------------------- There are another 5 or 6 steps he outlines, including "launching a media blitz" (probably not practical for most sites) and monitoring 404's and the redirects in Google Webmaster Tools (great advice). But here's another take (from Threadwatch.org, that hub of sardonicism): ----------------------- "Each time I move sites the one just replaces the old one in the serps with little to no loss of rankings. I had one last week that went from number 3 to number 12 but that will probably rise back up over the next few weeks." Source: http://www.threadwatch.org/node/13176 ----------------------- So let's compare: laborious, intensive, expensive switch ala SEOmoz, or instant, easy, turn-key switch from Threadwatch. Which one is it? Well, it seems if you can get special treatment from Google it doesn't matter much: ----------------------- "By the way, it looks like the primary issue with the Windows Live Writer blog was the large-scale migration from spaces.msn.com to spaces.live.com about a month ago. We saw so many urls suddenly showing up on spaces.live.com that it triggered a flag in our system which requires more trust in individual urls in order for them to rank (this is despite the crawl guys trying to increase our hostload thresholds and taking similar measures to make the migration go smoothly for Spaces). We cleared that flag, and things look much better now." Source: http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/scoble-visiting-the-plex/ ----------------------- Ah, to have Google on your side... to breath fresh... to bathe in the mountain mist... Sorry about that, got distracted for a second there. All this is on my mind today because of the Topix.net hubbub - they apparently plunked down a cool $1MIL for Topix.com and plan on migrating to that domain, but are wary of a jinx by Google. What do you think? Is switching domains a simple matter of utilizing a proper 301? Or is it more complicated, and will your rankings suffer long-term? Cheers, adam --------------------- From: Tom Anson [email]: Subject: Figuring out Google rankings Greetings fellow LEDers. I have a problem, and I'm wondering if anyone can give me some idea as to how to fix it. In building my websites, I've tried to keep in mind all the basics of good SEO. I avoid spammy techniques, use h1 tags and unique page titles and descriptions. I add alt tags to my graphics and avoid stuffing them with keywords. And I try to keep my keyword phrases in mind and use them appropriately to make sense to my visitors. As a result, some of my pages rank pretty well in the search engine results -- and have even before I knew anything at all about SEO. (Except for alt tag stuffing, I seemed to have a pretty intuitive sense of what a web page should have and not have.) My problem is this: I was on the Mercola.com website and added a comment to one of the posts there. In that comment, I mentioned some of the products (essential oil blends) that I sell. I didn't give a link or mention brand name. But, out of curiosity, I thought I'd do a Google search on one of those blends (Peace & Calming) to see if anyone might actually land on my page if they decided to look for it. I was quite disappointed and perplexed by what I found. First of all, my page (www.therapeutic-grade.com/products/blends/peaceCalming.html) was nowhere in the first three pages of results on a search for peace & calming. With some 400,000 YL distributors with websites out there, and the fact that I haven't taken any real steps to really optimize the page, that doesn't distress me that much (although I'd love to find a way to rise in the rankings). What really bothered me were the pages that ranked ahead of me in the SERPs. I didn't take the time to look at the source code or incoming links for any of these pages, but from what was seen on the page, several only used the term peace & calming in a link to another page, almost none had a page specifically devoted to Peace & Calming, most were cluttered with a lot of other garbage. One page had a good presentation of the oil blend, but also included a lot of other information about essential oils, in general (stuff that I cover -- better -- elsewhere on my site). In terms of page focus, I don't see how it would rank ahead of my page. And, in terms of incoming links, I doubt that most of these pages really had any (but, that's just a guess). But the kicker, to me, was the presence of the YL replicating site (like mine at www.youngliving.com/anson). I always thought that these could not get ranked in the search engine results. I've seen the same kind of thing for another website I have, where my page www.essential-vitamins.com/stemTech/index.html ranks below a replicating site from the company (like mine at http://essential.stemtechhealth.com). So, I guess I have two questions: 1) How do you get a replicating site to rank in the search engine results? There is nothing that I can do to change the page itself (although the YL site does allow me to feature my choice of products, or no products at all). 2) Am I missing something really important on my web pages that is causing them to be lost in the search engine results? Your comments would be most appreciated. Thanks. Tom Anson Anson Aromatic Essentials http://www.therapeutic-grade.com ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Joe Halbrook [email]: Subject: Hosting > I know most LEDers who have their sites hosted probably > have their own favorite hosting company. - Tom Aman, LED Digest 2365 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1766/55/ Tom, I've been exceptionally satisfied with my hosting company, ArteryPlanet (http://www.arteryplanet.net), for over 6 years now. They have excellent value-added hosting plans, complete with all the development and tracking tools you could imagine. And their pricing is very competitive, as well. The best facet of doing business with ArteryPlanet has been the phenomenal support I've received over the past 6 years - simply unmatched in my 13 years of web development experience. Joe Halbrook http://www.cleanmymailbox.com ============ Sponsor Message =========== At GetWebContent.com, the price of quality is always right. Not always the same, but always reasonable without ups or extras. Just ask for a free, no-obligation proposal and we'll quote an exact price for precisely what you want. Don't be fooled by bogus fixed-price offers for drag-and- dump generic copy. Visit www.GetWebContent.com/LED where our copy, and our prices, are custom-tailored for you. ============ Sponsor Message =========== -------- new post - new topic --------- [note: i'm using this slow period to clear out the backlog of posts; what's published today should get us up to date again. -ed] -------------------- From: Michael Martinez [email]: Subject: Bad SEO > What I believe is missing from this burgeoning > industry is an independent certification through > an association that has strict levels, guidelines > and a verification process. - Barry Shoor, LED Digest 2348 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1746/55/ Well, it probably won't be long before people jump in to tell you that SEMPO (Search Engine Marketing Professionals Organization http://www.sempo.org/learning_center) is now offering SEO classes and certification. With about 500 members it is, I believe, the largest such group in the industry. I'm not planning to earn SEMPO certification. I'm not impressed with the level of advice they give in their public archives (which are teasers designed to encourage people to join the organization to read the full articles). Michael Martinez http://seo-theory.blogspot.com/ -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Al Toman [email]: Subject: SEO guide Having a math-science-'gineering background, understanding the SEO way of creating, composing, and conducting scientific research (though I'm a bit rusty) I know how to systematically approach the study of this SEO. First, as a community, we need to formulate a hypothesis: 1) "What is this SEO about" 2) "How to Optimize Web Pages for Search Engines" 3) "How to Optimize Web Pages" ("How does a web master optimize a web page", etc., etc.) #1 has inherent issues and is probably of little interest to typical webmasters of business web sites. #3 points to a more over-all view of web pages and may be too generalized at this point. For example, a web page may be script-optimized (W3C validator) or accessible-optimized (Watchfire Web Xact validator) or this SEO optimized (?-free-for-all validator). This would result in the ultimate optimized web page, however, it is too confusing for many of us. #2 appears, in some form and fashion, to be what most LEDers would hold as an interest. But this has to be more precisely determined by the community as a whole. Second, we need to objectively establish accurate and precise definitions: SEO = Search Engine Owner SEO = Search Engine Operator SEO = Search Engine Optimizer If this be the case, then, we'd need to consult with the likes of Mr. Larry Page and Mr. Bill Gates. With these definitions, if someone claims to be an SEO, a Search Engine Optimizer, then, how do they define the roll of Mr. Larry Page? Does this SEO, then, have absolute control of the SE itself and its algorithms? My guess is, is that those who claim to be SEO are not SEO at all. Definitions will keep everyone on track and focus on the core of the issue, experiment, or research project. Third, we need to clearly understand the objective. 1) To attain a high ROI. 2) To feed hungry search engine(s) 3) To attract, keep, and convert traffic We need to review the hypothesis. The main components are Web Page, Optimize, Search Engines. Here, none of these have anything to do with ROI or traffic. #2 appears to be the closest match. #1 and #2 are more closely associated with web page promotion or marketing (online, offline, on page, off page, etc, etc) Fourth, we need to clearly understand the workings of these main components As an example, "Web Page". All three, W3C, Watchfire, and SEO clearly state that the html source document MUST have a TITLE. As pointed out on LED issue 2317 [see http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1686/55/ ], the construct of the TITLE is an experiment in itself. We all can hypothesize, however, objectively, what are the facts? Considering, each element, attribute, and thingy of a web page has to be fully understood. As well, "Search Engine". Google, MSN, Yahoo, Ask and the others are purely business models. They have "unknowns". Unkowns (variables) in research makes life a living hell. However, we must endure. 1) What works? 2) What works consistently? 3) To what degree does "it" work? 4) How does it work? (donno. they won't tell) Fifth, we need to establish a control to which our hypothesis is measured in our experiment / research: This is how an UNoptimized web page behaves on (name of search engine). This is how an Optimized web page behaves on (name of search engine). Sixth, we develop a method of research, conduct the research, and record the findings and results Seventh, we summarize and conclude (even if the result is that a web page cannot be optimized, for example) Eighth, we share the data. Nineth, we have a beer and do it all over again~! Tenth, instead of doing all of this work, we can call Mr. Page and Mr. Gates and request "intelligent" search. --??-- Nah! Al Toman studio9 web design ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by GetWebContent.com The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. Free no-obligation proposal: http://GetWebContent.com/LED The Archives: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/126/120/ Subscribe: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/52/77/ Unsubscribe, Change Email, or Hold / Resume Delivery: http://www.led-digest.com/content/category/4/17/86/ (c) Copyright 1995-2007 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "We forfeit three-fourths of ourselves in order to be like other people." - Arthur Schopenhauer |
