| LED Digest 2465: The Burden of Free Consultations |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom www.GetWebContent.com/LED : the LED's Key Sponsor The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ : the LED's Premier Sponsor Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. August 7, 2007 Issue no. 2465 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ====== NEW ====================== --== Free Consultations ==-- ~ Shari Thurow "Some people have the audacity to ask me question after question after question..." ==== CONTINUING ================= --== SEO and Web Standards ==-- ~ Beth Earle "...there's a slightly different take, straight from a Googler's mouth." --== The Hell of CSS [was: SEO Standards] ==-- ~ Nancy Cardinali "I'd have to rebut every comment made about CSS and it's degree of difficulty..." ~ Rich Dudley "Check out the CSS support in the next version of Visual Studio..." ~ Michael Linehan "CSS is not the problem." --== The Hard Sell of 'Free' ==-- ~ Reg Charie "...FireFox has made millions by incorporating their AdSense account as the search tool." --== Marketing Ethics ==-- ~ Barry S Mills "...it stands for User Generated Content." =========== NEW ================================== From: Shari Thurow Subject: Free consultations Hi all- I've been meaning to ask the group this for a long time, as I am not a salesperson and don't have that talent / skill. I get a lot of people who want a free consultation in different forms. Some people ask me to take a quick glance at their respective Web sites and want some quick feedback. Some companies put out RFIs or RFPs purely to get a free consultation (and I try to sniff those out so I don't waste my time). Some of my SEO colleagues are good about mailing each other when we can tell someone is scoping us out purely for a free consultation. An example would be an RFP with questions about strategy. The company gets strategies from a number of SEO firms and doesn't hire any of them. So that's one thing I do that helps. The one I have the biggest problem with? The people who ask me to do a quick look-see at their sites. If I have a couple of extra minutes, I don't mind doing it. I have this rule about doing one completely selfless act per month, and sometimes, a quick look-see is my selfless act. Two things: Don't ask me for my opinion if you don't want it. I've been doing Web design and usability and SEO for 12 years now. I have a lot of data and experience to back up what my opinion of a site is. Some sites I look at are great; some of them are not. My feedback isn't meant to be spiteful. I just get upset with people who want my opinion and then label me as unprofessional or not an expert just because, well, their site wasn't as great as they assumed I'd say. They asked for my opinion. Second, the follow-up. Some people have the audacity to ask me question after question after question just from the quick feedback, which I am doing because I want to. In reality, my time is valuable to me and my clients. If I am taking the time to give you a freebie, don't take advantage of me, and knock it off with the name calling because I'm not giving a full site analysis for free. End of vent fest. I am not this forthright when these situations occur. I just want to communicate the sentiments. Have any LEDers had this type of situation in your respective fields? How did you handle it more effectively? Like people who want endless renditions of logo designs (ugh). My tip, just to reiterate, is to have a good community to sniff out the RFPs / RFIs that are bogus and share. Any other good ones? Thank you! Sincerely, Shari Thurow, Founder and SEO Director Omni Marketing Interactive ~ Search Engine Visibility book now available http://www.searchenginesbook.com/ ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Beth Ann Earle Subject: SEO standards > .... HTML coding standards - regardless of who > proposes them and who enforces them - are > irrelevant to search engine optimization. - Michael Martinez, LED Digest 2464 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1875/190/ Hmmm ... I'm not quite so sure ... A coworker (unaware of the discussion currently raging in the LED) emailed me a link to this piece last week: http://searchenginewatch.com/showPage.html?page=3626600 The article is based on an interview with "Dan Crow, who is part of Google's search quality group and is the Product Manager for the crawl infrastructure group". At one point, the writer asks Dan "if it would help to move JavaScript and CSS definitions to external files, and clean up tag soup(?) Dan's answer was refreshingly clear. 'Those would be very good ideas,' he said." So, there's a slightly different take, straight (in theory, at least) from a Googler's mouth. Wishing all the best to LED'ers everywhere, Beth Earle www.pilotfishseo.com ============ Sponsor Message =========== Have you sat down and read your website lately? What your site says is crucial in converting surfers into customers and meeting search engine mandates for fresh, unique copy. Our all-pro writers have Fortune 500 experience. For top-quality, customized, cost-effective copy, visit GetWebContent.com today. http://GetWebContent.com/LED ============ Sponsor Message =========== -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Nancy Cardinali Subject: The Hell of CSS > [CSS is] the meanest design environment I can remember, > except for designing in postscript, which I dimly remember > and was HELL. > CSS encourages cookie-cutter design, limited to the > styles already set. It's suited best to output from content > management systems. - Shaun Johnston, LED Digest 2464 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1875/190/ Whoa Shaun! I'd have to rebut every comment made about CSS and it's degree of difficulty, but I KNOW others will do that! It took me awhile, and a bit of nudging, to finally jump into CSS (and I still don't use it fully). I am sooo happy I did. I won't rant on, but I do hope you will take the time to learn it. Believe me, you will be a happy camper. I'd be willing to help you 'crack the code', if you ned help along the way. Good Luck! Nancy Cardinali www.CardinaliDesigns.com *Consolidate your online and print image for name recognition* -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Richard J. Dudley Subject: The Hell of CSS [was: SEO standards] > I reckon we're 10 years from getting a respectable > web design program with a decent GUI. - Shaun Johnston Help may be closer than you think. Check out the CSS support in the next version of Visual Studio: http://weblogs.asp.net/scottgu/archive/2007/07/25/vs-2008-web... You don't have to be a programmer to use VS -- support for C# et al. is only part of the package. In fact, many of these features will be available in the free Visual Web Developer Express, and some are in the current Expression Web tool, which replaces FrontPage. Rich Dudley www.bloomeryweddings.com -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Michael Linehan Subject: CSS formatting > I don't use CSS, I use the old and no-longer supported FONT > tags. And I expect to go on doing so until they no longer work. > With CSS, every web site essentially becomes a new design > program, - Shaun Johnston Hello Shaun, What you are describing is akin to having a fifty-page Word document where every heading and every paragraph is individually formatted. Do you use "Styles" in such a circumstance? I hope so. Otherwise, I hate to think what you'd have to go through to change any formatting in that Word document. CSS formatting is just the Web equivalent of using those styles in a Word document. Just like "every web site becomes a new design program", every Word document's styles are different. This really is not a problem. The ease of manipulation of formatting enormously outweighs any problem with setup or with the styles being different in different documents. Also, one thing that may make considering CSS easier - work with CSS formatting first. Then consider CSS layout further down the road. I am not a CSS geek - i.e. "CSS is the only true way". It's simply that I remember when I shifted to using CSS formatting instead of font tags and so on. The ease of use is staggering. > CSS encourages cookie-cutter design, limited to the styles already > set. It's suited best to output from content management systems. Take a look at www.csszengarden.com. What you'll see there goes far beyond most web design in its creativity and graphical quality. CSS is not the problem. The problem lies in the abilities of some of the people using it. Banal, cookie-cutter design can also be seen from those who use table-layout or individually specified fonts. Michael Linehan, Marketing Alchemy www.marketing-alchemy.com -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Reg Charie Subject: Selling free > Free, open-source Firefox has made serious inroads > into IE's market share with no marketing budget. - Veronica Yuill, LED Digest 2464 I have always understood that FireFox has made millions by incorporating their AdSense account as the search tool. Reg Charie http://DotCom-Productions.com -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Barry Mills Subject: Ethics > Barry, forgive my ignorance -- what's UCG? - Shel Horowitz, LED Digest 2464 Apologies to Shel & anyone else not familiar with the term -- it stands for User Generated Content. I was rushing, but that's no excuse, sloppy posting. In this case I was thinking of reviews, testimonials and indeed criticism from users commenting on the ethical (or otherwise) practices of companies they have done business with. Make sure you get the legal position right and don't end up assuming responsibility for the content of posts though! Barry S Mills Chairman Netstep Corporate Communications http://www.netstep.co.uk ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by: GetWebContent.com The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. Free no-obligation proposal: http://GetWebContent.com/LED SEOToolSet.com Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification Join the certified SEO directory: www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ The Archives: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/126/189/ Subscribe: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/52/187/ Unsubscribe, Change Email, or Hold / Resume Delivery: http://www.led-digest.com/content/category/4/17/201/ (c) Copyright 1995-2007 Orange Wheel, LLC. 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