| LED Digest 2505: Visitors Aren't Always Right |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom www.GetWebContent.com/LED : the LED's Key Sponsor The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ : the LED's Premier Sponsor Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. October 3, 2007 Issue no. 2505 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ==== CONTINUING ================= <Moderator Comment> ~ Managing Tons of Email --== Placing Links on Client Sites ==-- ~ Charles Oertel ~ Eva Rosenberg ~ Martyn Gay ~ Chris Nielsen ~ John Taylor --== Site Usability Mistakes ==-- ~ Shari Thurow ======== CONTINUING =============================== <Moderator Comment> Greetings LEDer, For years I've had to deal with multiple email accounts. I've got emails for personal stuff, business, email lists, admin duties, different domains, the list goes on. My total email accounts, that I check each day, are 10. I would be drowning in the abyss of email overload without help from my friend Adam Boettiger. Adam has been practicing Internet strategy and marketing longer than most any of us. 1996 marked his foray onto the web, and he's still active in the industry today. Among many other talents, he's a master at project efficiency, and has helped me a ton to manage my email load. Case in point: http://www.iadam.org/2007/09/29/how-to-create-a-free... For anyone wanting to leverage the free email and file storage at Gmail, and keep a master (searchable) database of all your business and personal email, this article lines it out. Read it and follow his advice -- I did and it's a boon to my productivity and overall "ease of mind," because I no longer suffer from a congested inbox. This is my chance to repay Adam for his years of guidance. While he's not really looking for work (he manages Internet marketing duties for a multi-million dollar agency), if the right fit came along I'm sure he wouldn't say no. His specialties are in media planning, online strategy, and general marketing duties. Give him an email or call and tell him I sent you: Adam Boettiger email (encoded): http://flow-to.com/email/LED.1191384101lyfx8h.mth (503) 946-6450 (Portland, Oregon USA) Oh, and he's also been an LEDer forever! Here's to your liberty from email overload, Adam ----------------------- From: Charles Oertel Subject: Placing links on a Client's Site Grant Crowell says putting a link to the site builder in the footer is bad because it cheapens the user experience and the designer [ http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1915/190/ ]. I disagree. I bet most users don't even notice the link, and if they do but aren't interested they don't follow it. Occasionally, if the design intrigues them they might go to see who did it. Most often, users don't even notice the design - all they want is content, downloads or to order something. Stuff in footers is ignored by all but the most fastidious. I link because I am proud of my work and don't mind putting my name to it. This incentive is one of the reasons open source software is of such high quality - the programmers put their name to it. regards Charles Oertel -------- new post - same topic --------- From: Eva Rosenberg Subject: Placing links > Web development companies, DON'T insert a link on > the footer of the home page to your own company site... > More web designers and developers need to better > respect both their clients and their client's audiences... - Grant Crowell Hmmm....good reasons. And quite altruistic of you, as a designer. But, if I really like the way a site looks, I often look for the designer and follow the link to see what their other work looks like, or the level of their skills. Putting the designer information in a one-line text link is similar to artists signing their paintings. Art lovers always look to see who the artist is. Why should a website be any less a work of art? Once upon a time, your Humble Guide, Eva Rosenberg, EA & TaxNerd www.taxmama.com www.taxquips.com -------- new post - same topic --------- From: Martyn Gay Subject: Placing links Grant, I would have to disagree with your points you made. > 1) There's no benefit to the client. This may be true, but then again the web developer can make it so that there is a benefit to the client. We offer a discount on our job board software to customers to accept a small link back in the footer of their site to our site. About 50% of clients choose to carry this link in return for a percentage discount on the purchase price of the software. In return we get not just added pagerank, but many new potential customers contact us saying that they followed a link in the footer of a site we'd built. Its important to note that our customers are given the choice, and some opt for the link back. > 2) It cheapens the user's experience. Again, this might be true if the link was very obtrusive, but that isn't what we want. We have just a small greyed out link in the footer. Most casual users of the site don't even notice it, because they aren't interested who built the site. For those that are, the link is there and they find it. When you buy a new Ferrari do you feel that it is cheapened by the prancing horse badge on the front? Or is your Ford cheapened in the same way? Is a movie cheapened by having credits at the beginning and end? > 3) It cheapens the designer As above, this depends on the style of the link. So long as it is subtle and unobtrusive it is no worse than having a badge on a car, or for a greeting card to have small details of the printer in it. Sometimes we are asked to build a site that we really don't like - we do what the customer wants and the site looks awful but the customer loves it - since its exactly what he outlined. In these cases we don't offer a link back discount, as we don't feel the site accurately reflects our work. A link back is just a term of the agreement between developer and client to be negotiated like any other term. It has a financial benefit to the developer, and may well have no discernable disadvantage to the site owner, in which case he may be more than happy to accept a discount for including the link. And if he doesn't want the link? Just like any other term of the contract the price of the deal is modified accordingly. Martyn Gay Job Board Software www.parodia.net -------- new post - same topic --------- From: Chris Nielsen Subject: Usability I live in Minneapolis, and there is a very well known roofing company here, Sela (selaroofing.com, not a client and no connection). My stepson just hired them to re-roof his house this past Fall. The main reason is that they are known to be a quality company and whenever they do a roof, siding, or remodeling job, they post a sign out font by the street to let people know who is doing the work. Crass marketing? Perhaps to some. But some might say it's shrewd marketing. I know for sure that it's effective. True, the sign only stays in place while they are working and not when they pack up and go on to the next job, but if you see that sign over and over again it does make an impression. I doubt the home owners complain, since it's clear they are not hiring a cheap unknown company, they've hired one of the best, and why not let the neighbors know? I used to always ASK our SEO clients if it would be ok to have a link on their site. This was way before linking got so crazy. My thought that the cost to the client was small, and the benefit to me as a small company could be quite a bit. Some clients agreed and some did not, and I was perfectly ok with those that declined. > There's no benefit to the client, period. I agree with you 100%, but only if the web design or SEO company that has done work for the client does not appreciate the gesture. I always have and tried to do some extra things for clients that show their appreciation in that way. If a client links to a service provider, that service provider should appreciate the fact. To me, it's free advertising and a testimonial of sorts. > It cheapens the user's experience. Really? A small link or graphic affects visitors that much? I thought it was just the reverse. When I see a great site, or one that is easily found in the search engines, I tend to wonder who was the talented person that did the work. A link at the bottom of the page makes that clear. Perhaps I am not easily distracted, but things like that at the bottom of the page never bother me if I am not interested in what they offer. I certainly would not try to say what people are or are not interested in. I know that I have often visited the sites of designers, SEO companies, hosting companies, and others that are lucky enough to have a link on a client's site. I think a free ad is a beautiful thing. > It cheapens the designer. Well, there may be some that create sites that are of poor quality and are ashamed of the work they have done. But shouldn't the public be informed as to who has created such a sad looking web site? If you find a site somehow, despite it being buried in the SERPS, should not the SEO so lacking in skills that is responsible be outed...??? I think the quality of the work determines if a providers reputation is tarnished or shined. Doesn't that make sense? Thank you, Chris Nielsen Nielsen Technical Services -------- new post - same topic --------- From: John Taylor Subject: Placing links How about a slightly different perspective? Many web site designers have one, or more, pages showing their portfolio in the form of thumbprints of their clients sites. The vast majority also offer the visitor a live link to view the relevant site. In my opinion this is good practice and offers a degree of reciprocation for the "designed by" link placed in the footer of client's sites. It's a win-win situation. I've found, and purchased, many products and services by following the less obvious links to other sites. John Taylor AdTrackPro.com ========= Begin Sponsor Message ========= 2007 Is Aging Fast, So Is Your Content! Remember when search bots visited every four or five months? Now their noses are in your tent constantly. Weekly. Maybe even daily. What's a webmaster to do? Give 'em what they want! Fresh copy. Great copy. Relevant copy. http://www.GetWebContent.com/LED copy. ========== End Sponsor Message ========== -------- new post - new topic --------- From: Shari Thurow Subject: Usability Hi all- This is in response to Alicia Lane's and Greg Thibadeaux's posts in LED #2502 [ http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1914/190/ ] regarding Web site usability and visited / unvisited link colors. > I would assert that the average web user > just doesn't know about the visited link > convention and is more likely to be confused > by the changing of link colors.... - Michael Linehan > So the feedback from the visited / unvisited > links doesn't even register with them, until... > hey, what's this? The links are a different color? > !@#$% designer! - Alicia Lane Oh yes, I have been called a "!@#$% designer" many, many times. (Big smile) A long time ago, I really thought I was a Web site usability whiz. I read Jakob Nielsen's books and Web sites religiously. I took classes and seminars from Jared Spool and Eric Schaffer. I loved the human factors field so much that I decided to get another graduate degree in this field. Blah blah blah. And then the one thing that slapped me back to reality? I did my first usability test, as an observer (not a facilitator). As an observer, your job is to listen, above and beyond all else. It is not to think, "Well this is what I would do." And that's what you hear from clients all the time, huh? "This is what I would do." Usability testing, IMHO, is really key for making a Web site usability expert... an expert. You can quote Nielsen and Spool all you want, but until you can sit there and objectively observe and/or facilitate a series of tests, AND scientifically tabulate the results, I don't believe that you are an expert in this area. Reason? You have to test on specific profiles, personae, and/or roles. (These 3 things vary among usability professionals.) The average Web user can have so many different characteristics and goals. I do heuristic evaluations and cognitive walkthroughs all of the time. So I certainly understand usability guidelines. Nevertheless, some usability guidelines fly out the window when dealing with a specific profile or role. There are 3 pivotal things I wish clients would realize: (1) You are NOT the user. Clients are not selling their products and services to themselves. The IT department (or whoever is in charge of building and maintaining a site) is not the primary user. That first usability test I did? At that moment, reality was staring me in the face: people do not think the way I do. People do not act the way I do, which leads me to the next point.... (2) Even if a user fits the profile / persona / role, the user is not objective or accurate about evaluating his / her own behavior. I have watched many, many participants say they are going to do something and then do the exact opposite. In one test, I have listened to both men and women deny that their eyes focused on cleavage in a photo, but eye tracking showed that they did. When I am a usability test participant, I love seeing my own results if the facilitators will allow it (they sometimes do). So when I hear, "Well, this is what I would do," I know that the client is not being objective at all. And it's hard not to say that, you know? And finally... (3) Users are not always right. Another myth about usability is the aforementioned, and also the belief that the customer is always right. I think of tomatoes and a food site that I worked on. A tomato is a fruit, not a vegetable. When I was in China earlier this year, at breakfast, I was snickering at the Americans who wondered why the tomatoes were presented with other fruits. Certainly, on a food Web site, I would accommodate the text in places to re-educate site visitors who believe that a tomato is a vegetable, but I would not change the categorization. This is clearly a case where the user can be wrong. I know, long post. But whenever you hear yourself or a client saying, "Well, this is how I would do it," see if you can keep these 3 things in mind. That is what I do whenever I hear myself saying it. Sincerely, Shari Thurow, Founder and SEO Director Omni Marketing Interactive http://www.search-usability.com ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by: GetWebContent.com The Web's Most Experienced SEO Content Providers. Free no-obligation proposal: http://GetWebContent.com/LED SEOToolSet.com Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification Join the certified SEO directory: www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ The Archives: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/126/189/ Subscribe: http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/52/187/ Unsubscribe, Change Email, or Hold / Resume Delivery: http://www.led-digest.com/content/category/4/17/201/ (c) Copyright 1995-2007 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "At last is Hector stretch'd upon the plain, Who fear'd no vengeance for Patroclus slain: Then, Prince! You should have fear'd, what now you feel; Achilles absent was Achilles still: Yet a short space the great avenger stayed, Then low in dust thy strength and glory laid." - Homer |
