| LED Digest 2577: Think Like a User |
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The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom http://www.WillMaster.com/Master : the LED's Key Sponsor Master Series Software - Get Connected with Your WebSite http://www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ : the LED's Premier Sponsor Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. January 28, 2008 Issue no. 2577 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ====== NEW ====================== --== Small Business Survey ==-- ~ Janet Attard "...we [are running] a survey..." ==== CONTINUING ================= --== 2008 Marketing Predictions ==-- ~ Lee Odden "[You're] characterizing the level or complexity of SEO work according to the size of a company." --== Bounce Rates as Ranking Factors ==-- ~ Barry S Mills "What you need to do is think like a user." --== Shilling Social Bookmarks ==-- ~ Paul Weaver "Sure, I'll take a stab at it." --== StoresOnline.com Seminars ==-- ~ Carrie MacKenzie "I spent about $3,000 and got a tin of cookies." ~ Lee Roberts "The family spent around $6,000 with StoresOnline." ========= NEW ===================================== From: Janet Attard Subject: Small business economic outlook - a survey Hi folks, Every couple of years, Business Know-How runs a survey to see what kind of year small businesses see coming. This year, with most of the country and world fearing a recession in the US, I thought it would be a good time to run our Small Business Outlook Survey again. If you'd like to participate (ie, take the survey - and I hope you will :) , the survey is set up on Survey Monkey. We do not ask for or save email addresses. The survey does use a cookie to survey takers will only take the survey once (assuming they don't delete their cookies.) The survey is here: http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=2EzIR24JinUXIihphZN2QQ_3d_3d I'd like to get as many small businesses from all industries as possible to participate, so if you know business owners who aren't in online businesses, feel free to pass on the link to them, too. We'll publish the results at the end of the month. Thanks! Janet Attard Small Business / Home Business Resources http://www.businessknowhow.com ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Lee Odden Subject: Predictions > It's an industry that could use a LOT of > clean up, not only in it's approach to > clients, but in it's demand for results and > facts among it's own participants... - Dirk Johnson, LED 2575 Hi Dirk, I do appreciate that the SEM industry needs cleanup. The low cost of entry to provide basic SEO services with lofty promises of success are in need of correction. Regarding, "...until the mundane basics are addressed for a website, it is kind of pointless to do the bleeding edge stuff." I agree. As for, "I refuse to be a cheerleader for this entire industry" that is certainly your choice, but the same rationale for skepticism you give for the SEO industry could easily be applied to the real estate industry, the medical profession, finance or any other discipline that involves expertise and consulting. I pay my accountant, my doctor, my lawyer and my building contractor happily without knowing every minute detail of their work because they possess unique knowledge I don't have time to aggregate and filter all of the tactical information necessary to execute those tasks. We work together to identify goals, time lines and what each needs to do in order to make the relationship work. In some cases, it might make sense for me to use only one person. In others, I need the unique expertise of a whole team or firm. I think you're doing the SEM industry a dis-service by characterizing the level or complexity of SEO work according to the size of a company. Not all company web sites have the same goals nor do they have the same problems to solve. Just because a company has low to mid six figure budget for search marketing doesn't mean they have to spend that much to solve their online marketing problems and reach goals. At the same time, there are numerous mid sized companies I've worked with that have allocated a substantially greater share of their marketing budgets to search because the results warrant the investment. To be sure, there are common issues which can be relegated to the "mundane" SEO tasks you mentioned earlier, but for web sites of different sizes, platforms, goals, industries, resources and time lines, each situation is unique and none of them would be satisfied with mundane marketing. Lee Odden Online Marketing Blog http://www.marketingblog.com ========= Begin Sponsor Message ========= WebSite's Secret Members Area You pay one fee and have unlimited access for 6 months to a collection of Will Bontrager's handy web tools. (Since this is a new service, the fee is still low.) The latest addition - Spam Resistant PHP Form: The form, the form handling script, and instructions are included in the download file. http://www.willmaster.com/SecretArea ========== End Sponsor Message ========== -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Barry Mills Subject: Bounce rates > I've learnt that to be a good fisherman, > you must think like a fish. I've been > trying now to apply that principle to the > online world: Think like a search engine. - Trevor Johnson, LED 2575 Nice analogy, but I'm not sure it quite works. Surely the search engine in this metaphor is more like the river or lake in which the fish swim. What you need to do is think like a user. I haven't done a lot of homework on bounce rates, but I think there's two sides to them. I have seen bounce rates go up and conversion improve simultaneously after a redesign. My theory, and that's all it is, is that lots of people research shortlists - they click through SERPs, check out the site, and when they're sure it is one for the shortlist they bookmark. If they're sure it isn't, they leave, and if they aren't sure either way they might look at a few more pages. I know I do this sometimes anyway. So in this scenario, a better site is more likely to get an instant bookmark, which will register as a bounce. With a bit of clever tracking, which I've never thought to do, you could measure return rates of the bouncing visitors, and reduce them to bouncers who don't return in say 30 days. That would be a better metric imho. Barry S Mills Chairman Netstep http://www.netstep.co.uk -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Paul Weaver Subject: Re: Shilling social bookmarks > ...I hope this suggestion is only slightly > inappropriate... Would anyone be willing > and able to manage a "shill" list of > subscribers' sites that would be added to > and promoted by other members of the list > within their social bookmarking accounts? - Erik Perkins, LED 2575 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1990/190 Sure, I'll take a stab at it. I put together a quick site I call SICoop. (The Slightly Inappropriate Co-op for Shilling Social Media Sites.) You can find it at http://www.electroniclearningkits.com/sicoop/ There's not much to prevent abuse right now other than the manual "delete and ban" approach, but it's a start. I don't want to invest too much time until I know if it will be popular, but if it takes off I will put in whatever it takes to make the tool valuable to LED readers. Suggestions are eagerly solicited. Best regards, Paul Weaver -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Carrie MacKenzie Subject: StoresOnline > Do you have any info or feedback from > StoresOnline seminars? Anyone that has been > successful with this program? - T. Scott, LED 2576 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/1991/190/ Stores Online.. Oh my.. it's been a long time since I've heard their names... My advice is to THINK CAREFULLY BEFORE PROCEEDING although maybe you'll get more out of it than I did. I spent about $3,000 and got a tin of cookies. They say they'll help you set it up.. but they don't. They end up charging you over $100 a hour to have someone help you which I couldn't afford.. so I just gave it up. Of course.. all this was learned AFTER the legal time I could get my money back. Maybe I'm just guilty of being lazy.. after all, I already had set up a few of my own sites, and just didn't set aside enough time to learn this properly. It just seemed like every time I turned around.. there was another program... another thing going, and it was only $3,000 for this $1,000 for that.. I'd told him I wasn't ready to get it that day.. but that I'd look it up when I was ready to get an online store.. but no.. You have to buy NOW, and We'll help you do this.. it'll all be set up for you.. then they give you a binder.. a tin of cookies, and you don't see them again unless they are asking for another sale. I realize they were likely just trying to help me get going.. I just wish they'd have done it by letting me wait till I was ready before pushing me to start. Look around first, and be sure it's what you want to do. Maybe I should sell you my access codes.. ??? ;) <cheap> Someday maybe I will look into it again, and try to use my codes.. but I find that they are high pressure sales tactics..* I hate that. * My uncle, who talked me into going with him in the first place.. spent over $5,000 and never completed it either.. they saw us coming... but they do sell dreams well, I have to admit that.. They know what to say to make you open up your wallet. There's a place online called http://www.sitebuildit.com I think you should also look there, as I've heard nothing but good things about them through the years. (I am not affiliated in any way with them) My apologies if I have offended anyone by my post. I know that some likely get very good results.. I just didn't.. and neither did my Uncle, and I really really wanted to make sure that y'all knew to be careful and compare, and be ready to proceed. Carrie MacKenzie ========= Begin Sponsor Message ========= One Way Links to your Site, by the Hundreds? Yes! Get Traffic and Link Popularity to Your Site from Legitimate, General Interest Web Directories. DomainDrivers Makes It Hassle-Free. Details Here: http://www.domaindrivers.com/directory-submissions.html ========== End Sponsor Message ========== -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Lee Roberts Subject: StoresOnline The closest I can come is a family at the LDS Ward I attend signed up for their service last year. Please understand this is from my work with them on their store and my follow-up. The family spent around $6,000 with StoresOnline. They were very ecstatic about having the opportunity to start selling online. They setup their store selling pet supplies. They followed the support manual and received some phone support. After launching their store, they began using PPC to advertise their products. They sent out an email notice to their friends and got their first sale. Boy were they happy. Unfortunately about three months after the site going live, things started to go sour. Sales were not coming in and they didn’t understand why. Then they remembered I work in the field. They asked me to come over and review their store. I obliged them and made a few suggestions. During my follow-up they began to become extremely discouraged; not discouraged with StoresOnline, but rather with their decision to sell pet supplies. I suggested they contact the manufacturers of the products they wanted to sell and see if they could find some _real_ distributors that would dropship for them. Unfortunately, they didn’t follow-up on that and I’ve let them go about their business. At no time did they say anything negative about StoresOnline. Regards, Lee Roberts Merchant Metrix, Inc http://www.merchantmetrix.com (c) Copyright 1995-2008 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "What ships have you, what sailors to convey, What oars to cut the long laborious way?" - Odyssey of Homer |
