| LED Digest 2661: Monetizing Established Sites |
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The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom http://www.AudetteMedia.com : the LED's Publisher Boutique Internet Marketing: SEO, SEM, Social Media http://www.SEOToolSet.com/training/ : the LED's Premier Sponsor Bruce Clay's Search Engine Optimization Training & Certification ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. June 11, 2008 Issue no. 2661 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ====== NEW ====================== --== Downsides to Multiple Sites? ==-- ~ Michael Lerner "[Are there] any negatives to have [multiple sites with] similar products..." --== Monetizing an Established Site ==-- ~ Barrett Rossie "...we think going to a free-content/advertising model has a lot of potential." ==== CONTINUING ================= --== SEO Standards ==-- ~ Alex Hughart "A combination of knowledge, experience and intuition is necessary in any area..." ~ Chris Nielsen "...with extensive testing that Google was only indexing about 100k of any page." ~ Shari Thurow "I certainly do not wish to sound condescending..." ~ Shel Horowitz "...I don't want to participate with a company that acts like a thug." ========= NEW ===================================== From: Michael Lerner Subject: Multiple Websites I was wondering if there are any negatives to have more than one website on the same server - similar products and same SKU's and prices. Michael Lerner promosontime.com ============ Sponsor Message =========== New Blog from Larry Chase Online Marketing Strategies, Inc Introducing "Internet Direct Marketing Tip of the Day" from Larry Chase's Web Digest For Marketers. This blog features: * Short, time-tested tips from traditional direct marketing that also work well online * Tips Larry Chase finds effective from publishing Web Digest For Marketers since 1995 View these tips, submit your own tips, and subscribe to the RSS feed at: http://www.wdfm.com/internetdirectmarketingtips ============ Sponsor Message =========== -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Barrett Rossie Subject: Monetizing an established B2B website Question for anyone and everyone: A B2B company distributes its information product via the web. Companies currently pay for the service. For a bunch of reasons, we think going to a free-content/advertising model has a lot of potential. It would sure shake up the market. We currently get about 100,000 unique visitors a year visiting our site; each visitor return up to 12 times. These visitors are in specific verticals, such as healthcare, that might be attractive to certain advertisers. If we go to the "free" model, we have no idea how many visitors we could get. It might be millions. How do we go about trying to determine how much revenue we'd be able to generate? Barrett Rossie barrettsbook.com ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Alex Hughart Subject: SEO standards > But I would hardly label what I'm > doing as a form of astrology. - Shari Thurow, LED Digest 2659 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/2074/190/ Shari, I'm so sorry you got that impression from my post. I see that, taken out of context, this doesn't sound good at all. The reason I used such comparison is to illustrate how, by superficially looking at SEO, one can easily come to this conclusion, not that it's actually the case. The fact that we are dealing with someone's intent (be it of a customer, business or a search engine) in an environment where the rules are not fully disclosed, simply means we'll never be on 100% certain ground thus a lack of the "exact math" and suspicions of snake-oil peddling. A combination of knowledge, experience and intuition is necessary in any area of expertise. At this point, it may seem that intuition plays a bigger role in SEO than in other more established fields of information sciences (established as in longer in existence) which is not necessarily a bad thing either. I certainly apologize to you and any other hard working SEO professional who found her/himself offended by this comment. The irony is, my intent was quite the opposite. Alex Hughart www.theparticipator.com -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Chris Nielsen Subject: SEO standards > But Shari, there does seem to be a certain > amount of numerology involved in SEO. > > My initial research on the Web gives a wide > range of answers - some info says the > Google engine only deals with the first > 65K, other info says that Google only > indexes the first 101K (or may stop after > the first 100 links, if that happens > sooner), still other info says that the > limits have been removed by Google. - Tom Aman, LED Digest 2660 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/2075/190/ While it may indeed be possible to use Numerology in SEO, the prospect of assigning numbers to letters in a domain name, meta tag, or page content brings up an image of madness much like the movie "A Beautiful Mind". Please, let's not confuse metaphors with methods or I will be forced to use Alta Vista and search for the same thing over and over again expecting at some point to get a different result. Astrology and Numerology both have their places and I respect them, but not in connection with SEO. Oh sure, you could do a natal chart for the "birth" of a web site, but to get any meaningful information you would have to determine where in the chart you would be able to see things like spider visits, server loads, and if the site uses CSS, JavaScript, or XML. Would the rising sign indicate how the design is perceived by visitors, or how effective the UI is? No, I prefer to stay sane and not go down that road. As to what search engines index, I can tell you from my personal experience a couple of years ago with extensive testing that Google was only indexing about 100k of any page. We found that content beyond that would not be found in the index. If it's important I can do a quick check and see if that is still the case. Yahoo on the other hand, seemed to index a page no matter how big it was, but the range of my tests only went up to pages that were about 1 MB. Thank you, Chris Nielsen -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Shari Thurow Subject: SEO Standards Hi all- This is in response to numerous posts in LED #2660. Nice discussion thread, but I also recognize that LED is not only a forum for discussing search marketing. So I will try to be brief. Regarding SEO and numerology. My interpretation of the word "numerology" might be different than what others might have thought. Numerology is a form of, shall we say, astrology (I might not be accurate in this definition/analogy), sort of like the signs of the zodiac. That is how I took its meaning. Regarding my sources of information. Many of my information sources come directly from people at Yahoo, Google, Microsoft, and researchers / scholars who were given permission to analyze items from these search engines. Criticize me all you wish, but you might want to remember that I am a scholar (as well as an SEO, Web designer/developer, usability professional). I have access to information that many might not even know about or consider. My methodologies, because I am a scholar, might be considerably different than a lot of SEO firms. And these methodologies work perfectly well for my business. To answer a direct question: no, Dirk, I was not referring to you specifically. But imagine all you want. It's a free country. :-) I certainly do not wish to sound condescending, even though it might seem that way on the surface. I have many sources of information, including the data I've gathered since 1995 on my sites and client sites, and usability test information, among other things. Well, that was my feeble attempt at being brief. Sincerely, Shari Thurow, Founder and SEO Director Omni Marketing Interactive http://www.search-usability.com/ -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Shel Horowitz Subject: SEO standards > My experience is proof that Google's > advertising offices have used this tactic > to attempt bring themselves more client > business. The question I am left with now > is, how much of it is tacitly approved by > those in charge at Google? - Grant Crowell, LED 2657 - http://www.led-digest.com/content/view/2072/190/ Well, I've been beating the ethics drum, pretty loudly, for about six years now. When big dogs are in the same market as poodles or even hamsters, i can be sticky. I'm not an SEO guy (though I try to at least somewhat incorporate SEO-friendly approaches in my copywriting)--but I *am* very active in the independent book publishing space. And in the last couple of months, we have a similar issue: Amazon.com has changed its policy and is forcing publishers to use Amazon's wholly-owned POD printer for those books published through on-demand printing. I consider this unethical, restraint of trade, and a bunch of other negatives. Although this policy doesn't really affect me, I don't want to participate with a company that acts like a thug. So I have terminated my 12-year-old affiliate account, and I've stopped *buying* from Amazon. I know others who've acted similarly, though unfortunately some major players capitulated quickly. I've written several blog posts about this: http://principledprofit.com/good-business-blog/index.php?s=amazon One of the philosophies I express in Principled Profit (which cites and/or has endorsements from many people in the old Adventive community, BTW) is that competitors are merely people I haven't figured out how to work with yet. In the case of a big player encroaching on a small player, it can be challenging--but it can be done. Remember what kick-started tiny (at the time) Microsoft: a partnership with giant IBM. But also it's totally appropriate if Google is engaging in unethical behavior (as has happened in the copyright arena) to join forces with others to either convince them of the value of having you as valued (unalienated) partners or oppose the giant through collective action. BTW, speaking of ethics, may I take a moment for a huge brag? I will be doing a Guerrilla Marketing book with Guerrilla marketing founder Jay Conrad Levinson, on ethical, green marketing strategies--to be published by John Wiley & Sons (a big NYC publisher). OMG! I have a firm offer and Jay's complete cooperation (though I don't yet have a contract). It feels a bit like collaborating with Mick Jagger. Not only that, but I was actually able to negotiate a 25% increase in the advance, without involving an agent. This will be my eighth book. Four published with traditional houses and four that I published myself. WOW! Dancing a jig here! Shel Horowitz http://www.principledprofit.com (c) Copyright 1995-2008 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "What hymns are sung. What praises said. For homemade miracles of bread?" - Louis Untermeyer |
