| LED Digest 2150: Billing Strategies |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" Data > Information > Knowledge > Wisdom pair Networks: The LED's Web Host Hosting and Domain Reg. from a Trusted Leader pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com .............................................. May 1, 2006 Issue no. 2150 .............................................. .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ====== NEW ===================== --== Marketing ==-- ~ Ben Sudduth ==== CONTINUING ================= --== Billing Your Time ==-- ~ Hitesh Patel ~ Beth Earle ~ James Haley --== Revisiting the DMOZ Dilemma ==-- ~ Claudiu Spulber --== Dealing with Shipping Costs ==-- ~ Greg Watson ~ Reg Charie --== Shared IPs and SEO ==-- ~ Anthony Kirlew ~ Michael Martinez ==== BILLBOARD =================== --== Hyphens in URLs? ==-- ~ Dirk Johnson ~ Michael Linehan ========== NEW =================================== From: Ben Sudduth Subject: Marketing Please take a look at our site www.naturear.com. We are a hearing aid company and have been in business for 5 years using an old design and shopping cart program. We have been reluctant to change because our site has been quite successful. It requires scrolling and has all of the negatives that a site can have, but our business model is solid and customers say they like the "completeness" and "amount of material" on our site. It answers most of their questions. Then they can purchase on-line or call during limited hours to puchase or get support by phone. The problem is the pay-per-click companies, Google and Yahoo, get most of the profits. Over the years we tried a variety of marketing services, none of whom provided any help. Only the pay-per-clicks continued to work. Are there any answers out there that are answers and not rip-offs? Thank You Ben Sudduth NaturEar info, naturear.com ======== CONTINUING =============================== From: Hitesh Patel Subject: Time and billing > I have a client that sends me small updates > that sometimes take less than 5 minutes. - Brett Atkin, LED 2148 I have been working for quite a few clients like this. I have found that 15 minutes increment is the break-even point. I cannot afford to charge for less than 15 minutes even if the actual work was 5 minutes. And generally this is true for most independent consultants. I use a simple Excel spread sheet with three columns: Date, Total Hours (1.25 or 2.75 etc), and brief description of work. This is basically my time keeping system. I have written a small Excel-VB module that generates weekly invoices for all clients that I had worked for during the week. It takes less than 5 minutes to create and print all invoices for a week. I don't think you should charge different hourly rate for different tasks to the same client. I follow one client one rate method. Generally clients would be more comfortable with that method. Let's not make our client's accounting system more complicated! I would not charge extra for the work done during weekends from my home. If I had to work from client's office during weekend, I would make sure that I charge extra for that. But I wouldn't commit to work from client's office during weekend unless it's at least 4 hours of work and it's perfectly OK with my wife! I also do time sensitive work for one of my client, and it's my unique value that I am able to do it. Otherwise they wouldn't need me. Sometimes, some of that work can become routine, you exactly know what you are doing, and you can use CPU cycle to do it for you by automating the procedure. Hitesh Patel http://www.webinfoinc.com hitesh, webinfoinc.com -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Beth Ann Earle Subject: Time and billing > In this 24/7 world, am I dreaming to think I shouldn't > be working every weekend to meet the client needs? > Am I the norm or the exception here? - Brett Atkin, LED 2148 Hi, Brett. Here are some quick answers about how our company handles these issues -- we've been in business 10 years, focusing almost entirely on business-to-business manufacturers. 1. After the first half-hour, we bill in 15-minute increments. 2. We used to provide "small" (i.e. less than 15-minute tasks) for free but found we were getting nickeled-and-dimed by our clients (they weren't taking advantage; it just wasn't a smart policy). 3. We now charge a minimum of $62.50 for edits and recommend that clients bunch their requests up so that they aren't getting $62.50'ed to death. It works pretty well. Sometimes, depending on the circumstance, we might waive the fee, but not normally. 4. We do bill different amounts for different types of tasks (although this is an internal function -- our clients only know their total bill) -- specialized work, such as SEO or Flash, is billed at an hourly rate that's 25% higher than what we charge for project management time. 5. Normally, we don't charge for fast turn-arounds. But ... on an occasional case-by-base basis, we have (with the client's understanding) added $100 or so to the cost of a project, if they have a serious deadline and we have to set aside other client work to satisfy their request. 6. We don't use anything to track our time, and that's a huge problem -- it's also completely my fault. Eventually, we'll get something in place. 7. We don't do weekend work. We work Monday through Friday, 8 a.m. to 5 p.m., period. Yes, sometimes I do take work home and fix it up in the evening or over the weekend (and I've even made 7 a.m. calls from home to clients because that's the time that was best for them), but that's my choice -- not an option we offer to clients. 8. For a simple edit (updating a phone number, posting a PDF, deleting a photo), we normally tell the client the work will be done in 1-3 business days. Depending on the timing of their request, the work is almost always done the day they contact us or the next day, at the latest. But, if there's a lot going on, we might actually need two or three days to fit the project in. 9. For a page or more of content that needs to be developed, optimized, coded, formatted and placed on a page, we usually say 3-5 business days, and that's usually how long it takes. I don't know what sort of client base you have, but nearly all of our clients are manufacturers who understand they have to pay for results and who understand that production cycles are production cycles and can't always be interrupted. In any case, hope this was helpful. Regards, Beth Earle www.pilotfishseo.com -------- new post - same topic -------- From: James Haley Subject: Time and billing Brett, I was thinking that maybe some of the time spent doing these mini changes could be off loaded to the client instead. Have you looked into content management systems out there. Lost of great and professional free software out there. You may lose some of those small billing chargeouts but you will give the client the ability to update their own site up to the last minute. You could even work in into your current code. I'm sure this will give you more free time for the family and the client can work up to the wire and do their own fixes. Sometime quality of life is better then a little billing time. Even the new LED site that adam is working on is a Content Management system and sure there is a learning curve but with great benefits. As for giving you ways to simplify your billing methods I'll leave that to the other site professionals. Happy weekends. James Haley http://www.911dating.com -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Claudiu Spulber Subject: Google DMOZ > Are there any suggestions of what one can do > to optimize for Google different from MSN or Yahoo!? - Mark Bishop, LED 2148 Mark, I would start by analyzing the log files a little. You have to see if you are receiving any visitors from Google for other keywords then the ones you target. I know that some will disagree but I also sustain the idea that Google has a "sandbox" where new websites are placed, and during this time you can barely see any visitors from Google. So if this is the case the best thing to do is to continue the optimization and wait until you're out of the sandbox. MSN / Yahoo doesn't use the same method, and I must admit that MSN especially is very friendly with new websites. When we launched one of our websites in less than a week we were on the 2nd position for the main targeted keyword. > And can anyone get into DMOZ anymore? > Does it matter? Regarding DMOZ, it would matter a lot if your website would be included there. Not only because they have high-ranked pages, but also because the directory is used on many other websites, thus you'll get much more backlinks. Unfortunately I think it's a matter of luck to be included in there. I've submitted 2 sites more than a year ago (and continued to submit them bi-monthly) and still they're not listed. Plus on the DMOZ forum they've stopped giving information on the submission status. Regards, Claudiu Spulber http://www.backup4all.com// http://www.novapdf.com// -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Greg Watson Subject: Shipping charges > We used them all, Fedex, UPS, DHL and > had nothing but problems with all of them. - Robert Bass, LED 2149 I don't agree with most of what Robert Bass wrote about FedEx, DHL, and UPS, but a solution to his comments about combining Shipping & Handling Charges using the Post Office can be found in Stealth Endicia... > The customers never see it that way. We have > it listed as Shipping & Handling charges and > they still write and tell us that the postage was > less than we charged them. I use a desktop postage application from http://www.Endicia.com ... it offers the ability to print your postage without the postage charges visible (they call it "stealth endicia") ... Endicia.com describes the feature this way: ----------------------- "Shipping and handling fees cover more than postage, so printing postage amounts on parcels can make for irate customers and lots of support calls. Stealth Endicia labels hide the postage amount, so you can charge fair S&H fees without worry." ----------------------- They also offer free electronic delivery confirmation, customizable automated shipping emails, and a variety of other features. I personally love the system... and a simply honest solution to Robert's concerns. Greg Watson -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Reg Charie Subject: Shipping charges > Is there a shopping cart that either limits shipping to within a > country or allows for additional fees to ship internationally? - Kathy Wilson, LED 2149 There is Kathy and it is called CRELoaded, (www.creloaded.com). CRE allows for flat rate, per item, using a table rate, world zones, single zone rates. You can specify where you will deliver to, (US only, US + Canada, etc), as well as the individual country shipping rates should you choose to allow shipping to other countries. Thank You, Reg Charie www.dotcom-productions.com -------- new post - new topic -------- From: Anthony Kirlew Subject: IP and SEO Re: Shared IPs First, there is a prevailing "theory" that your site can be banned if a site that you share your IP with is banned (or uses questionable practices). I haven't heard too much about this happening lately, but I wanted to at least make note of it as that is where this topic often leads. That said, one of my criteria for using I personally do not ever recommend using the services of hosting providers that host adult content. Secondly, if you are hosting multiple sites on a similar IP block and they link to each other, this could be considered "excessive cross linking" and have a negative affect on your ranking. With this in mind, it may make sense to utilize a few different hosting providers if you happen to operate multiple web sites. Anthony Kirlew Web Traffic Team http://webtrafficteam.wordpress.com Visit our Internet Marketing Blog -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Michael Martinez Subject: IP and SEO > ... if you're sharing an IP address with > a spammy site, sometimes... a search > engine would ban the entire IP address... - Beth Ann Earle, LED 2149 Yes, *several years ago,* that was a legitimate concern. Altavista was at that time still an independent search service, and they banned by IP address. It was a stupid methodology, widely criticized, and even they eventually came around to accept that many innocent sites were being hurt by the practice. Today, no major search engines ban by IP address. Shared IP addressing is not a bad thing, it doesn't put your sites at risk. This is just another SEO myth that won't die. The industry is constantly evolving, and even if something was true and useful to know several years ago doesn't mean it is helpful today. Michael Martinez "Cuando Maria canta, canta para mi" http://www.michael-martinez.com/ http://michael-martinez.blogspot.com/ ==== BILLBOARD =================================== From: Dirk Johnson Subject: URL hyphens Chris Nielsen provided some down-to-earth insight [issue 2149] into the hyphen hype, such as: > Domain snobs have long looked down > their noses at domains with hyphens... and > There has been a real... advantage to having a > domain with hyphens, because it allows the search > engines... to consider your domain name keywords > when indexing your site. This whole issue is just another example of SEO hysteria that bubbles up from the forums. Has there ever been any definitive proof that hyphenated domain names are "penalized"? None that I know of. To the contrary, I am aware of a lot of hyphenated URLs ranking quite well. It's all just wild speculation, based on very weak logic, and it comes from people who want to label anything they don't like as "spam". As Chris pointed out, there are legitimate reasons for hyphenating a domain name, or a page name. A hyphen is a valid character in a URL, per the W3C standards. People should use it (or not) as they see fit. Automatically assigning sinister intent to it's use is a real stretch of logic, and fortunately, the search engine engineers at the search engines seem to know this, in spite of what is bandied about on SEO forums. Best regards, Dirk Johnson, Partner - Operations DomainDrivers LLC www.domaindrivers.com www.linkstrategy.com -------- new post - same topic -------- From: Michael Linehan Subject: URL hyphens A domain name is, I think, enormously more important for people to remember for themselves and to pass on to others, than for any tiny SEO effect gained by having the words made readable to the search engines by adding hyphens. Fiona Raven has her own name as her domain. Her most important search term is book designer. On an "all these words" search she comes up number two out of ninety million! So Bev (I read somewhere that you should hyphenate), the domain name does not matter. Imagine the conversation, "Saw this great site. You've GOT to visit it. The name is www.book-cover-and-interior-design.com". Can you imagine the difficulty of getting that across? Or on the phone with a prospective client. Or at a networking meeting speaking with someone. I know this from experience, "That's marketing hyphen alchemy dot com"! (Someone else got the non-hyphen url, first.) A short, memorable name is much better for marketing, and web marketing is ultimately PART of marketing, for most businesses. Michael Linehan Marketing Alchemy www.marketing-alchemy.com ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by pair Networks: pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains © Copyright 1995-2006 Orange Wheel, LLC. All Rights Reserved. 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