| LED Digest 2201: Weighing Outbound Links |
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List Moderator: Published by:
Adam Audette LED Digest
adam, led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com
.............................................
July 12, 2006 Issue no. 2201
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.....IN THIS DIGEST.....
==== CONTINUING =================
--== Are Outgoing Links Important? ==--
~ Michael Linehan
"It's not a matter of having too many links in
some absolute sense."
~ Michael Martinez
"People pass around a lot of myths and
nonsense about links..."
--== SEO Conferences & Public Speaking ==--
~ Dirk Johnson
"It's time for some fresh new voices, from
people who actually do this work."
==== BILLBOARD ===================
--== Web Hosting Newbie ==--
~ Pepper Kay
======== CONTINUING ===============================
From: Michael Linehan
Subject: Outgoing links
> ... can you have too many outgoing links
> to other web sites?
- Paul Harris, LED 2200
Hi Paul,
It's not a matter of having too many links in some absolute sense.
It's a matter of having too many around their link.
At one end of the spectrum, imagine THE top authority site in your
field giving you, and only you, a recommendation and a link. Around
your link is keyword rich, on-topic text. And the link itself is
formed on the keywords that are most critical for you. Now imagine
the other end of the spectrum --- you are on a links page with one
thousand other links, the link is on the dreaded words "click here",
and none of the text around you is on-topic.
The closer you are to the former end of that "links spectrum", the
better. So, they ask for no more than 15 links on the same page.
Michael Linehan
Marketing Alchemy
-------- new post - same topic --------
From: Michael Martinez
Subject: Outgoing links
> I receive regular "invitations" to swap links with other
> sites - the majority of the sites are in no way connected
> to my business. One caught my notice recently as it
> said their link must not be on a page with no more
> than 15 outgoing links.
- Paul Harris, LED 2200
People pass around a lot of myths and nonsense about links, and you
can see many of them in these unsolicited reciprocal link
invitations. There are usually two concerns behind such requests.
First, some people foolishly believe they are getting a benefit from
exchanging links with "High PR" pages. They are looking at Google's
Toolbar PageRank (which values your page from 0 to 10) and have the
mistaken belief that those numbers are used in ranking pages in
search results. They are not.
Secondly, they wrongly think that outbound links dilute or leak
(Toolbar) PageRank. Real PageRank is a value between 0 and 1 and it
represents an estimate of the probability that a random surfer will
click on a link leading to any given page. Google's method for
calculating this probability estimate has changed through the years,
in that so many people try to inflate PageRank that Google now
claims to ignore some links.
Your page's PageRank is entirely dependent on what acceptable links
point to your page. It doesn't matter how many outbound links you
put on your page. Some so-called SEO gurus who write bogus PageRank
tutorials fabricate little diagrams that suggest if you link out to
other people's pages you'll "lose" PageRank, which is absolute
nonsense.
However, for other people, it makes a difference if you have 1
outbound link or 100. They want as much PageRank as your page can
confer to their pages. So in asking you not to put more than 15
links on your page, they are hoping to get more PageRank from you
than they would if you put 30 links or 100 links.
This kind of thinking is just plain stupid. People don't understand
that the sum of all PageRanks is 1. If Google is assigning PageRank
to 25 billion pages, then before they start to calculate their best
estimate of PageRank, they divide 1 by 25 billion and every page
begins with that 1-over-25 billion value. So worrying about how
many outbound links are on your page is just pointless. Your page
is only conferring a miniscule amount of PageRank anyway.
Finally, as Google engineer Matt Cutts talks about reasons why
Google may penalize or ban sites on his blog
(http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/), people will look at the specific
details he provides and use them to justify silly new rules they
make up. Matt warns people to be careful about who they link to and
how much they link out. He specifically pointed out in one post
that "excessive reciprocal linking" may not be a good idea.
What does he mean by "excessive reciprocal linking"? No one really
knows. But people are now going to start assigning irrational
limits to outbound linkage in the mistaken belief that they can
influence Google's algorithm. But trying to control rankings
through PageRank is like trying to scoop up water with an open hand.
You're not going to accomplish much.
Generally speaking, if linking to another site would be a good thing
for your visitors, you should do it regardless of whether you'll get
a link in return. Making your site a useful, reliable resource will
help your search engine rankings far more than obsessing over
PageRank and trying to decide how many outbound links are "safe" for
any one page.
Michael Martinez
"Cuando Maria canta, canta para mí"
-------- new post - new topic --------
From: Dirk Johnson
Subject: Conferences
> ... quit whining about the lack of speaking opportunities.
> If you want to be a professional speaker, do your research
> and earn the privilege. Be diligent. Be patient. Earn the
> privilege and prove your worth.
Shari Thurow, LED 2200
In reply to Shari's response, a couple of quick points:
Shari, you seem to assume that I have never done any public
speaking, which would be incorrect. You also seem to assume that I
have made offers to present on this subject in the past. I have not.
I really don't want to be on the podium, but I did recently submit a
proposal to an upcoming event. We'll see what happens. I am willing
to do what it takes.
At many large SEO shows, it's a parade of the same people, all
offering their same old perspective on linking, again and again. I
would like to think that it is the show management's responsibility
to seek alternative voices.
But you did make very good points about tailoring a presentation to
the audience, pitching the concept, etc. You provided advice that
would be well-taken for anyone, including me.
However, you ignored my main point, which was that many well-known
individuals at the top of the SEO world fail to understand
reciprocal linking, and, when it's done properly, how it plays out
with respect to site traffic, the search engines, and the overall
branding effect on a website. The primary reason for this lack of
understanding is because they have done little or none of this work,
yet they pontificate endlessly about the subject.
It continuously baffles me how people who don't really do something
can claim to know so much about it, and, in the face of considerable
evidence to the contrary, they continue to hold to their
conclusions. But that is exactly what's happening at the top of the
SEO world with respect to reciprocal linking. It's time for some
fresh new voices, from people who actually do this work. I really
don't care if it's me, or from someone else. I'd prefer that it be
someone else, actually.
To reiterate, most (but certainly not all) claims about reciprocal
linking that have been espoused by the so-called "well-known
experts" in this industry fail completely to hold up to close
scrutiny. Yet more keep coming. I read a new one just yesterday,
from one of the biggest names in the SEO business. It's now
pervasive, and it is not serving well the people who rely on these
experts for advice, as it leads them to make choices that likely
cost more and may well be less stable and effective.
There are two worlds at work here with respect to reciprocation.
Those who listen to the "experts", and those who ignore them. Those
who ignore the misguided advice and just continue to reciprocate
responsibly and appropriately are earning advantages that may become
very hard for competitors to overcome later. I see that take place
all the time. I can tell you that the people who are ignoring the
pundits are well aware of the advantages that they are establishing
for themselves. These people are not fools.
These are the people that we deal with daily, and they just keep
doing what works. Many have done it for years, even pre-dating
Google. I am on a first-name basis with many of the oldest
practitioners in this business. Some are in the SEO business, but
many are just astute site owners. Very few of them have attempted to
become high profile personalties in the SEO world. Why tell the rest
of the world what works?
Shari, you said, "Quite frankly, the entire post rubbed me the wrong
way." No doubt. Comments you've made in the past about reciprocal
linking and the work that I do have done the same to me. Fair
enough? You should also know that I also received private replies to
that post that were fully supportive of what I said, from people in
this industry. Not everyone is enamored of the "experts" and their
advice. Posturing "expertise" is something that we should all be
very aware of in the SEO world. Everyone does it, and some more than
others. By and large, SEO work is not rocket science.
I fully expected that you and others in the SEO community would take
exception to my post. It was purposely pointed. I am not here to
couch my arguments in ways that you approve. I am here to convey a
point of view that is not getting much of any exposure, and that
point of view is based on considerable experience at this work.
Best regards,
Dirk Johnson, Partner - Operations
DomainDrivers LLC
==== BILLBOARD ===================================
From: Pepper Kay
Subject: Web Hosting Newbie
Hi All:
I am a newcomer, not to the Internet or computers, but to the idea
of getting a domain name and putting up a web site ...
I continue to hear horror stories with regard to domain names being
held for ransom, being pointed to areas of interest of someone else,
being over priced, under serviced, ad nauseam ... or, the process
being made so technical, that Einstein spins in his grave at the
mere mention of some of the ISP's that abound ...
I see ads - "Host with us for $2.99/month - 1st 3 months free" or
"Domain Names free - host with me" or "With egg rolls, you get sweet
and sour soup" or, or, or ...
I have explored some of these and find that the '3 months free'
comes after you pay 1 year in advance - or - the 'Domain Name is
free' with a $100 deposit ...
Can someone give me some recommendations for a service provider who
will host a relatively simple series of pages - no Flash, a few
small graphics, no 'Gee Whiz', zoomy tech-stuff ... just basic
information, pictures and contact info for condos we own on Maui, HI
AND will allow me to be the administrator and OWNER of everything ??
An additional consideration also is that I don't 'talk tech' ... I
need something that I can basically, press a button and have it
upload and be available ... I used to have a SPRY account and it was
great - easy to use - easy to create / modify and / or change
content - easy to upload and more but the big drawback was that the
URL had to have SPRY in the lead position ...
Thanks in advance,
Pepper Kay
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