Marketing & SEO Discussion List - LED Digest

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From: Pete Hopkins < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Banners, looking at them, and other fun stuff

Responding to the last poster about this subject, I think it's a great
idea to have URLs on a banner. I'm a regular reader of Suck magazine,
but they make the mistake of splitting their articles across many
pages yet putting ads on each. There have been banners that I've
longed to click on, yet haven't because I want to read the rest of the
article. If the URL was included on the banner, I would have gone
there. Suck wouldn't have gotten the click-through, but then, the Coke
machine doesn't know you saw the ad on TV. I think that Internet
advertising is a slave to the click-through, which needs to change if
the click-through is to be less important. (Funny how that works.)

What I'd like to see is a banner like:

"Want FREE advertising on thousands of sites?"
"LinkExchange"
"Write down this URL: http://www.linkexchange.com/"

Sites with their own domain names certainly have the advantage in this
game, but other sites can make good use of it. Logos are much more
memorable than words. By having a distinctive logo for your site, you
can associate words with it. Then, sponsor things like webrings, or
make Netscape-esque little animated boxes for people to put on their
pages, or mini-advertising or something like that. Your ad then means
so much more, because seeing your logo (and make your site's color
palette based on this logo to give that "feel") reminds the user of
all the other things.

As I said before (I think...) the ad is a war between the content
presented and the content promised. Sometimes, the content presented
will always win (me and Suck), and sometimes the content presented is
worse than the content promised. While this is good for short term
click-through gain, your site will gradually degrade as it becomes a
"jumping-off"  point, not a content provider of its own. This is why
I'd like LinkExchange to measure "click-aways" so you know how much
traffic is being taken away from your site by the banner. This may
cause some people to leave the Exchange when they realize LE is taking
viewers away from them more than they're coming in.

Still, you get the question at the heart of every site:  "Is it more
important for someone to read the content, or just to see an ad?"

the Sylvan Librarian


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From: DCCharly < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re: New Way to look at Banner Ads

This is in response to the general thread about getting across the
actual URL of your site somewhere within your banner advertisement. I
currently work as the creative director for a network of sites
(shameless promotion -- http://www.andover.net), and I always, always,
always include the URL for the advertised site somewhere within the
banners that I design for external promotion (ads that run outside of
the network.)

Here's why:

1. People like to know where they're going when they click. I'm sure
you're familiar with those amateurish javascript links that, instead
of displaying the target URL of the link you are about to click on in
your browser's status bar, show some dorky text message. This =
annoying.  Another example: server-side image maps. Also, the way that
the majority of banner advertising networks (L.E. included) work is by
passing all sorts of variable strings through some sorting program
somewhere so that when you let your mouse hover over the banner, this
is what appears in your status bar:
http://members.tripod.com/bin/accipiter/adclick.exe?SID=1209 . That
doesn't mean anything to anyone! On the other hand, IF, somewhere in
your banner you include (as tiny yet still readable as you like) the
URL of the site you want people to visit, the click-through on that
banner will increase. It's a psychological thing. Trust me.

2. This one's even more important.
Have you downloaded IE4 or Navigator 4.0 yet? If you have then you'll
know what I'm talking about. If you haven't, what's your excuse?
Version 4.0 of each browser has a nifty little feature called
AutoComplete. When you type an URL into the browser's location field,
the browser will attempt to finish the URL for you. Hmmmmm... Why
would Microsoft and Netscape both suddenly feel that was important
enough to include in their 4.0 browsers? Because they discovered that
that's how a large number of people navigate their way around the
Internet. By simply typing URLs that they have memorized into the
browser location field.  So, even if an ad impression doesn't cause
someone to click on your banner immediately, as long as you've
included your URL in the banner somewhere there's a chance they might
remember it and show up later.

Of course it helps if you've got a great, easy to remember domain
name, like pitchfork.com, cooltool.com, linktosuccess.com, etc. If,
however, you're stuck with something like
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/1311/index.html, I still
think it's worth it to put your URL in the ad for reason #1.

BTW: Hi. New to the list.

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From: "Rodney Blackwell" < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re: Banner Ad Associates Program

Hello All,

I hope this post can be of use to everyone. It is in response to the
message from Richard Ackerberg in LED#242.

>I want to place banner ads on targeted sites and pay a refferal fee
>of $7.50 for each each antique gumball machine I sell through that
>site.

There is a software program by the folks at WebGenie
(www.webgenie.com)  called "Site Sponsor". I believe it fits your
needs perfectly.  The website gives the advantages and drawbacks to
that type of program, so I won't list them here. (I am not a reseller
or a promoter for this company, but I can attest to their great
software that I personally use for my websites.)  - Thanks to everyone
for their feedback about my T-Shirts! Around the Web.
(http://www.circle-r.com/teering/) post (LED #210). We have made some
great strides and some of our members are reporting a 30% increase in
traffic.  We are getting new sites added every week!

Hope this helps,

Rodney Blackwell         
co-owner/webmaster           
T-Shirts! Around the Web.


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From: This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it
Subject: Associate programs

Re:  Associate programs, Richard Ackerberg wrote:

>Is there a program available that can track which site the orders are
>coming through so that I can appropiately send my referral fee to the
>correct web site?  Any help would be appreciated.

Another site that may be helpful here is LinkShare Corporation at
http://www.linkshare.net/index3.html.

They describe their mission as:

"For the Online Merchant, (a web site that is commerce enabled)
LinkShare offers a software plug-in to a merchant's commerce server or
shopping cart program. With LinkShare, merchants can instantly create
an affiliates program (we call them "Synergy Programs") with sites on
the Internet who wish to sell and promote their goods."

Ron Herschaft
(no relationship to LinkShare Corrporation)

++++ new post - new topic ++++

From: Bill Pratt < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Outstanding Free Website Maintenance Stuff

Submitted for posting on the Link Exchange mailing list:

Hi folks. I usually don't get to read the entirety of these posts, and
I NEVER get time to post, but I found a few pages that are so
outstanding that I felt I had to pass them on. For all I know, these
have appeared on this forum already. At any rate, check them out (they
all are free).  I swear I have no connection with these pages other
than being a delighted user.

First, the best banner program imaginable: The Banner Generator. I
know what you are thinking--a few colored backgrounds and a line or
two of small courier type. NOPE. This thing has DOZENS of fonts in all
colors, several special effects, and dozens of great colored
backgrounds. It includes a special section on LE-sized banners. I
created several the other day and I already am seeing great intial
clickthru ratios. Check out this outstanding service at
http://www.coder.com/creations/banner/.

Next up, the place I found the banner program. This URL contains
several cool looking things for webmasters. I have not had the time to
go through them all. I almost guarantee you will find something to use
up on this page. Check it out at
http://www.dreamscape.com/frankvad/free.webmaster.html

Finally, another potentially neat place. A free stats service that
tells you where the people are coming from! Yes, I said FREE! I have
not signed up yet, so I can't really endorse it. But if it does what
it says, your'e golden! SuperStats is at http://www.superstats.com/

Hope one or all of these services bring you lots of fun and prosperity
in the new year! Check out the new banners I've created at X051911,
X149334, and X326488. I'm not quite sure if you can see them without
the password. If not, check out my page below. Two of the banners
appear on it (Wicked Hot Rod T-Shirts and Hard Core Drag Stuff).

Regards,

Bill Pratt
This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it
Drag Racing List Online - Info on 25,000 racers, videos, photos, & more!
http://www.draglist.com


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From: Tom Aman < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re: Search Engine Are O.K., But We Need More Than Just A List

In digest #243, "Lawrence O'Neal Rouse" < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it > wrote:
>Along the way we were bothered by a few products pretending to be
>shareware but when they were downloaded after say an hour and a half
>they turned out to be just trialware with a time limit.  I find that
>annoying.  I need more than a few weeks to pound on a new piece of
>software I'm going to wind up trusting to support our commercial
>work. Wouldn't Andy Rooney say it something like that?

>I want the option of using the product as it is for as long as I feel
>it is necessary to evaluate it. ...............

While the time limit may be annoying, I think the real problem is that
there was nothing at the download location to indicate that there was
a time limit.  When you encounter something like this, please take a
moment to go back to the site and email them to let them know how
annoying this is.

I have no objection to the time limits, I only object when the fact
that there is one is not stated up front.

While is may be noce to have the option of using a product for a long
as you feel necessary to evaluate it, consider:

1. You don't get this option when you buy off-the-shelf software in a
store - you have to hope that the advertising hype and reviews have
given you all the info you need.

2. For a lot of people trying out shareware, "as long as I feel it is
necessary to evalute it" translates to mean "forever without paying
for it".

I have a shareware product, and it now includes a 60 day time limit.
The original version of the product never expired.  It was interesting
to note that after I added the time limit and the initial 60 days
after adding it had expired, the number of registrations I was getting
increased by a factor of about 4.  This says to me that a lot of
people were using the product on a continuing basis without bothering
to register it.  That is why you find so much "trialware" on the net.

Tom Aman                
SpyderMaster
Aman Software http://www.cyberspyder.com/
Home of CyberSpyder Link Test

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From: Pretty00s < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re: LinkExchange Digest #243 - Free CGI Hosting

In response to Bob Mueller in LE Digest #243:

>Now to my question. I would like to add several forms and a survey to
>my site, but I do not have CGI capability at my present ISP, and
>don't necessarily want to move just yet. I have seen and am checking
>out WebForms 2.7 from Q-D Software ((http://www.q-d.com) which lets
>you run forms without CGI, but I am also told that there are sites
>available that will let you run CGI scripts on their server for a
>site somewhere else. Does anyone know of any free sites like this? I
>have FreeStats for traffic logs, but I'm looking specifically for
>forms and scripting capability.

I've scouted a number of these services for visitors to my site.  Two
sites offer free cgi hosting for form apps, as well as others, are:

CGI-Free
http://www.cgi-free.com/
and
Server Corporation WebApps
http://server.com/WebApps/

Hope this helps!

Julie Bordelon
Free Webmasters' Resources
http://members.aol.com/pretty00s/WebmastersColony/index.html?dg


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From: "Felecia C. Berry" < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Subject: CGI/Forms question

I am trying Webforms and I'm not completely happy eith it.  It doesn't
always read my e-mail forms completely.  I am also trying out a cgi
script that I wrote in C++ that changes the "+" signs to spaces, "&"
to new lines, and "=" to spaces.  If you want to learn more about cgi
scripts take a look at comp.infosystems.www.authoring.cgi

http://www.pinn.net/~bchoice/
Buyer's Choice
The Best Choice for Retail Products at Wholesale Price


++++ new post - same topic ++++

From: "Deanna Dudney" < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re:  CGI/Forms question

Hello, Bob,

You might try Response-o-Matic.... they give you all the instruction
you need to create forms, and it goes through their cgi-bin (all
free).  Their url is http://www.response-o-matic.com/home.htm.

Deanna Dudney - This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it
The Celtic Heart - Handcrafted Wire Jewelry
Visit our online shop at http://www.celticheart.com


++++ new post - same topic ++++

From: JStakely < This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it >
Subject: Re: CGI/Forms question

A good list of free forms hosting can be found at the always useful
Cgi Resources Index, specifically at:

http://www.cgi-resources.com/Programs_and_Scripts/Remotely_Hosted/

I have heard some good things about Q&D Software, although I haven't
tried Web Forms 2.7 myself, mainly because I do have use of cgi on my
own domains and have a number of scripts I already know well.
[Personally, I have a problem with programs that spit out code
automatically (i.e. Perl, or even WYSIWYG html software), primarily
because often times folks have no idea what the code means, and
haven't a clue what to do when something doesn't work correctly, if at
all.] Anyone who has hacked Perl scripts knows that a misplaced comma
or double quotation can be the difference between "Thank you for your
submission"  and "Server Error 500".  <g> Similarly, if you want to
put together a form that doesn't require cgi, you really don't need
software to do it for you.  On the flip side, reviewing and
understanding the code after having the software lays out the form for
you is a good learning experience.  My advice is to go with one of the
free hosting resources above if you need a script installed remotely.
You shouldn't have any problems.  I believe a couple of them let you
fill out a form at their site, and your form is automatically
configured for you.

Jason Stakely
This email address is being protected from spam bots, you need Javascript enabled to view it