| LED Digest 1917: Maybe Linking is Dead... |
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================================================== The LED Digest Moderated Discussion List "Effective Online Advertising, Since 1997" pair Networks: The LED's Web Host Hosting and Domain Reg. from a Trusted Leader pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains ================================================== List Moderator: Published by: Adam Audette LED Digest adam,led-digest.com http://www.led-digest.com ............................................... January 11, 2005 Issue #1917 ............................................... .....IN THIS DIGEST..... ==== CONTINUING ================= --== Problems for Linkers ==-- ~ Robert Bass "Why would I want to attract people to my website and then...send them to some other website?" ~ William Ernest Waites "...what other links does a consumer benefit from?" ~ Phil Tanny "I must report data that may possibly support the 'reciprocal linking is dead' hypothesis." --== Keeping the Harvesters at Bay ==-- ~ Peter Lapinskas "...I got some spam even with the image." ~ Martha Retallick "Nowadays, I treat my e-mail addresses like a highly confidential unlisted telephone number." ==== BILLBOARD =================== --== Legal Action on Link Farms? ==-- ~ Peggy Deras --== Dropped by Google ==-- ~ Shari Thurow --== CSS Cross-Browser Issue ==-- ~ Tom Anson ===== CONTINUING ================================= From: Robert Bass Subject: Linking I have to say that all this discussion about reciprocal linking totally eludes me. I spend on the average US$5000 a month advertising both online and in print media, a proper sum, no? WHY would I want to attract people to my website and then, when they get there, send them to some other website? Especially when considering that about half my traffic is from PPC advertising, I just do not see the point. Google may like to see one's link on a million other websites but don't they realize that most of these are from link farms and the like and have nothing to do with merit or relevance? When all of this SEO business first started I refused to get involved; my site is what it is and I don't chase my tail trying to make it conform to the latest set of perceived SE rules. First it was meta tag content, now it seems to be this linking business, what will the next round of gibberish be? Those with the phrase "no fool like an old fool" buried somewhere on a page will get top ranking? For my number one keyword search I have ALWAYS been in position number four on Google, MSN, Yahoo, Ask Jeeves, Dogpile etc and never once conformed to these ridiculous "standards". It is only for the lesser terms that I use the PPC system, and then only sporadically. But I am not going to spend a bundle to bring them in and then catapult them off to some other site. Emperor's new clothes? Robert Bass, Webmaster http://www.jewelex.com ------- new post - same topic -------- From: William Ernest Waites Subject: Linking Just an observation. I have been on the web since before it was a web. I have seen Google rise from a funky name to a search powerhouse. I understand the value of "linking" as a concept. I question the application of it as criteria for establishing site popularity when it is done principally - at least in reciprocity situations - to make a site "appear" popular when, in fact, it has only been successful in aggressively pursuing links. As I reflect on the ability of links to reflect popularity, I can't recall more than five times in the last five years that I have actually accessed a links page for suggested links - unless I was looking for link partners for my site. I realize that this is anecdotal. But I wonder how many others regularly use links on link pages to find and access other sites. And if it not very many, what does that say about linking as a useful tool in the age of Google. Granted, before there were large, powerful, ubiquitous search engines available, links were a critical way to locate sites with related information. But today, when you can enter a search term in Google or Yahoo and get anywhere from thousands to over a million links referred, what other links does a consumer benefit from? Just wondering. Sincerely, William Ernest Waites, Eyewriter "Words that make pictures." (c) ------- new post - same topic -------- From: Phil Tanny Subject: Reciprocal Linking I wanted to applaud Dirk Johnson for his detailed and thoughtful post about reciprocal linking [issue 1916]. Nice work! I have a few items to add, on both sides of the issue. Pro Reciprocal linking is almost always discussed in regards to SEO, and so one of it's most interesting benefits often gets overlooked. Reaching out for reciprocal linking partnerships can be a great way to be to meet people in your industry and establish productive mutually beneficial relationships on a lot of levels. Link partners are potential friends, allies, mentors, and more. Has anybody married one of their link partners yet? :-) I was recently discussing a link swap with one webmaster, and in the process discovered he has a perfect affiliate program for me to promote on my site. I'd suggest setting up a mailing list just for your link partners and use it to develop these relationships in to something more. One of the people on that mailing list may someday give you the breakthrough idea you use to push your site to the next level. Con Now I regret I must report data that may possibly support the "reciprocal linking is dead" hypothesis. A few issues back Adam was kind enough to post a message from me introducing my new site, Links-For-You.com. As you'll recall, it's a free service that delivers willing link partners in your niche to your inbox. 50,000 of you received that issue, and about 5 of you signed up to receive these lists of willing link partners. What does this tell us? I honestly don't claim to know. The leading theories might be: 1) Webmasters have read so much about reciprocal linking they are now tuning the subject out. 2) My description of Links-For-You, here and on my site, is poorly written. 3) The concept behind my service is not as useful as it I think it is. Again, I admit to bafflement, and additional theories are most welcome. If you wish, you can do what I'm doing, and use my site as a test case of whether reciprocal linking is dead or not. Please be assured I haven't yet made enough money to take Adam out to lunch so you won't be making me rich if you visit or discuss the site. All I want is the same thing so many have said they want, an easy way to find willing relevant link partners. So Link Exchange Digesters, this is a use it or lose it alert. If I don't see more interest I'll stop promoting the service and redirect my investment in to buying text links from Dirk and other vendors. Whatever your strategy, best of luck to everybody! Phil Tanny http://links-for-you.com ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Peter Lapinskas Subject: Harvesters > The most effective method in my view is publishing the > address as an image... The email address is visible to > humans viewing the image, but harvesting robots probably > are unable to extract it. - Will Bontrager, LED 1915 First, let me say thanks to Will for his work on the subject and for making his solution available to us. I haven't tested it yet, but it sounds like a significant step forward in the fight against spambots. I have done a little experimental work myself on the subject of protecting email addresses on websites, by publishing different email addresses in plain HTML and using various forms of obfuscation and compared the amount of spam I got with each. As you might expect, I found that the greater the level of obfuscation, the lower the amount of spam, in the following rank order (from most spam to least): Plain HTML 'mailto' ASCII code substitution Javascript coding on page Javascript coding in .js file in folder protected by robots.txt image of email address The interesting thing is that I got some spam even with the image. This may be because I published it on a contacts page in the form: Email: [image] Maybe the bots are smart enough to figure out context and send back any images which appear on a contacts page, or adjacent to the word 'Email'. The collected images could then be fed through an OCR program and any usable addresses extracted. More effort for the spammer, but more likely to yield real addresses. They may even get some satisfaction in spamming people who really don't want to be spammed. Therefore, my 2c worth is to take care with the page text if you plan to post your email addresses as images. Best regards Peter Lapinskas ------- new post - same topic -------- From: Martha Retallick Subject: Harvesters Sorry to break the news, but the most effective means of preventing spammers from harvesting e-mail addresses from your website is to omit those addresses altogether. I reluctantly came to this decision three years ago, when I found that the e-mail addresses on one of my sites had been harvested -- bigtime. In order to stop the spam deluge, I put in a contact form that allowed people to get in touch with me without exposing my e-mail address to the harvesters. But the horse was out of the proverbial barn. The deluge continued. In the end, I had to shut down that site and all of the e-mail addresses associated with it. Nowadays, I treat my e-mail addresses like a highly confidential unlisted telephone number. Martha Retallick, "The Passionate Postcarder" http://www.postcardmarketingsecrets.com ==== BILLBOARD =================================== From: Peggy Deras Subject: Legal Action Against a Link Farm Hello LEDers, I am hoping I can get some advice as to how to handle an unwanted excess of popularity for my web site www.kitchenartworks.com. I have been inundated with backward links to a GoDaddy link farm. They all link to ServiceMagic.com. I have resigned from ServiceMagic and they have responded appropriately but GoDaddy is another story. I have sent several cease and desist emails, but have gotten no response from them other than a typical "we will respond in the order received". I am looking for some legal muscle now as my ranking in Google is sinking fast. I get 70% of my business through my web site because it has good content, so I am very protective of it. Anybody have any suggestions? Peggy Deras ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Shari Thurow Subject: Dropped in Google > We run a very successful community based website in the UK... > For four years we have done very well in Google ranking... At the > start of Christmas Google dropped our domain name > www.ukvillages.co.uk all together. - Rupert Dick, LED 1915 Hi there- I just wrote a 2-part article in WebProNews that addresses this very topic. The headlines are different, but it is a 2-part article. Part 1 is at: http://snipurl.com/bx5b Part 2 is at: http://snipurl.com/bx5c I hope you find them helpful. Sincerely, Shari Thurow, Webmaster/Marketing Director ~ For Free design and marketing tips, visit us at: http://www.grantasticdesigns.com/tips.html ------- new post - new topic ------- From: Tom Anson Subject: CSS layout issue across browsers Hi LED-ers, I'm trying to help a friend build a website for his non-profit organization. Our expreience is limited, and it's really showing on this site. We're trying to build without tables, but our CSS skills (or lack thereof) are showing. You can see a sample page at http://www.ansondigitalconcerns.com/acf/index.html. It's not complete, but there's enough there to demonstrate our problems. The page actually displays close to what we're looking for in IE, but in FireFox and Opera, it's a whole other story. The main issue in IE is that there's a slight blue space between the leftNav and the content of the page, with a corresponding break between the border-top of each div. The only other thing we'd like to do here is add some scripture texts that line up with each of the sections in the feature div. We'd like to have them float to the right over the gray background of the headlines div. At some point, we'd probably want to add a graphic near the top, with the same kind of floating effect over the grey sideBar. However, in FireFox and Opera (and who knows where else), we can't get the grey background of the headlines div to extend the full height of content, and we get this blue border entending between the feature and headlines in content. We'd still like to have the scripture quotes float right over this grey background. We've pretty well exhausted our imaginations on this problem. Any ideas? Thanks. Tom Anson toward optimal health www.ansondigitalconcerns.com ------------------------------------------------------- The LED Digest is sponsored by pair Networks: pair.com for Hosting | pairNIC.com for Domains © Copyright 1995-2004 Adam Audette. All Rights Reserved. ----------------------------------------------------------------- "The years teach much which the days never knew." - Ralph Waldo Emerson |
